I have initiated the process with the NJ Motor Vehicle Commision to apply for Collector Status for my 1999 Firebird. (No laughing...) In NJ there are 2 types of antique/collector status. The first is the Historic or QQ tags. Car must be over 25yrs old, with heavy restrictions on when, where you drive.

The second is Collector tags for which the car must be at least 10yrs old but not greater than 25yrs old and you are limited to 3,000 miles annually, but you can drive anywhere, anytime. You then get to skip going through State Inspection (still responsible for self-inspection), but have to provide a letter from a car club or the vehicle manufacturer stating the vehicle has some element of collectibility (is that even a word?) or low production totals. So I call Pontiac and ask them to put together a letter with production numbers based on my VIN. Surprisingly, I got a nice letter from them (after a couple of tries) breaking down the #'s for my car based on engine and tranny. Turns out my car is pretty "rare" (not collectible rare, but not many made type rare). So I'm feeling pretty good about satisfying the NJ MVC requirement, but now I have to secure some type of collector insurance and this is where I am worried. I have no problem meeting the annual mileage requirement and can store the car in my garage, so none of that is a problem.

My hang-up is they all seem to mention racing. Now the only "racing" I do is autox events (SCCA mostly). My car is stock appearing from the outside, but I do have a 4pt bolt in bar, primarily to support the Kirkey Intermediate RR seats. How do I best handle this situation? I have no expectations of coverage while participating in an autox event. Anyone have experience dealing with this? I'd prefer to not lie on the application (that's grounds for fraud). Is autox seen as racing? One of the applications I have seen on line doesn't use the word racing, but instead uses "timed event"?

My main motivation for this is to save a few $, get better coverage (with an a stated value) and skip the whole state inspection crap (in NJ what a PITA it is). This year I failed for a gas cap????? I don't drive the car on a daily basis, don't drive it during the winter months (mid Nov to mid March) so it's not a big deal to comply, except the whole "racing" issue and when they ask for pictures and see the roll-bar......

Anyone been through this in NJ or other states?

Thanks
Chris

All I can say is that I'm happy I was grandfathered when they changed it to this more restrictive nonsense.

If this helps, I have the car insured as a recreational use vehicle. So that means weekends, not for work, or to work on a regular basis. They ask for proof of insurance but I don't know of anything that specifically states 'collector' insurance. Go figure.

So what happens when the car passes the 25 year mark? Does it have to get QQ plates? Since it is grandfathered since before the new restrictions do I have to comply with that? All of my friends' old cars are QQ and FAR from stock. Can we assume that they're grandfathered too? This is such a mess.

Also mine failed for a gas cap before I registered it as a collector, the o-ring was all cracked up so it wont seal, vent toxic fumes....

This post has been edited by slowTA: Jan 21 2010, 12:20 AM

Do you have collector status with the DMV (triangle sticker?) or just a recreational use insurance policy?

If you got the collector status (from the DMC/MVC) prior to 2007 (I think) then you can keep the status for as long as you own the car.

I have collector status on my 1970 Nova and am grandfathered in, so I am not forced into QQ tags even though the car is now 40years old. But if you obtained the collector status after 2007, then when the car hits 25 years old then yes they will force it into QQ status, which is very restrictive, but not often enforced. Who do you use for insurance if you don't mind me asking?

Chris

Yep, I've had the funky triangle since '05 or '06. My insurance is NJ Manufacturers.

I've also heard that if you let the registration expire you have to get the new version. Needless to say I'll keep the frame of this car no matter how used up it gets.

Yeah that's kinda true. I was late one year on my Nova and they didn't raise a question, but I never took it off the road (from a registration standpoint) and always had the insurance up to day, so maybe that helped me. Best best is to just keep it current.

That's who my insurance is through currently and they gave me a pretty good quote, but they want pictures of the car. If they see the roll bar and the seats (more so the bar) I'm sure it would raise a flag??? Other than that I think I'm good to go. Do you remember if they asked you about racing or anything along those lines?

Chris

I don't think they asked about racing and didn't bother with pictures. The lack of pictures could have something to do with my coverage, no collision only basic with theft. Also my car is an '88 so age may have something to do with it.

NJM doesn't ask a lot of questions really. They look at your driving history and the vehicles you own and write a policy based on your needs.

As long as you have something else to drive day to day they have no problem writing a limited use policy.

I am in the middle of a similar decision with my car or next car. Some time this summer I have to decide to keep or sell, build or cruise, and what to do about my insurance and registration.

-Tim

I have agreed upon value totalling $50K on my race car, trailer and all the trailer's contents from Heacock. The premium is $500/year. As long as the race car is not moving under it's own power while at a race track, I'm covered from all the normal comprehensive and collision coverages.

They also offer "modern collector car" insurance.

http://heacockclassic.com/passion/modern-collector-cars

Not sure what the rates are, but it might be worth a call.

That question is likely to open a big can of worms... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

If it has timers and trophys involved, it's racing... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

You might want to check with Grundy. They'll insure anything of any year as long as it isn't your daily driver, stays in a locked garage on your property. If you're taking it away for the weekend, as long as you call them and let them know, you're covered. My '69 Chevy C-10 is insured with them for 10,000, ( or 12,000, I forget), and it costs about 170.00 a year to cover it.

Last I talked to Grundy they won't insure anything with a bar or cage in it and they require pictures of the car. Unless something has changed that leaves Chris out.

-Tim

I asked about this years ago. The way that the SCCA has it's legal descriptions written all of their events are "driver's education" and the argument could be made that means they are eligible for your regular insurance to cover. I don't know how far that argument would get you, but it could be made if you really felt like pushing the issue.

-Tim

I don't remember that. When they started covering my old Chevy, I hadn't even completed the interior. I did send pictures though. Seems odd that they'll cover street rods, (some with bars, cages, etc), but not his Trans Am. Might be worth another call.

I filled out their online application so we will see what happens. At least they seem to understand that performance cars are occasionally driven in a "controlled" but spirited manor. I have no expectation of coverage while participating in an autox event. Thanks for the link. We'll see what they say.

I filled out their online application and spelled out everything, so we'll see what they say. I'm not looking to get rich quick on this deal, just looking to get collector registration and insurance to match. And if they don't say what I want, then I"ll give them a call.

You must be an insurance salesman or a lawyer... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Only kidding. I think that's why some of the applications don't use the word racing, but instead "timed events". I think somewhere in the SCCA rulebook it states that course designs should be such that vehicles don't exceed legal speed limits (65mph?), but we hall know how that sometimes works.....

I'll keep everyone posted.

Thank You Mitch.....

We have a winner. Heacock was very easy to deal with and seem to have a very good understanding of what I do with my car, the coverage I was looking for and gave me a great quote. For my 1999 Firechicken they quoted me $250 for full coverage with a stated value of $10,000 (more than that and they wanted comps, appraisals etc.) and they are OK with me doing autox, HPDE's, or whatever else I decide to do. They are OK with the roll bar and I provided a detailed list of all the modifications to the car with pics of everything so there is no confusion or gray areas as to what the car is equipped with and its intended usage.

Chris

Here is what I discovered in talking to a few of the big name players in the Collector/Classic Insurance industry:

Grundy asks is the car used for racing or rally events. I answered YES.....and was promptly denied an application. They say they do not offer insurance for any car that is used in a timed or on track event. They also don't like to see roll bars, which the car has. Elitist snobs, they just about hung up the phone on me.

Haggerty wanted the car to be at least 10 years old to qualify as a what they call a "modern" classic. They did not have a problem with the car being raced (which was promising), but they require that the daily driver vehicle be less than 5 years old when insuring a "modern" classic. Unfortunately my 1997 Dodge Ram (Cummins Powered) doesn't meet that requirement. I tried to talk my way around it, but to no avail. Very nice people to talk to, I just didn't meet the criteria.

Barrett-Jackson didn't ask about racing at all (so I didn't volunteer) and told me they would get back to me in a couple days with a quote. Well a couple days later they got back and said "through various internet sources" it has been determined that the car is currently or has in the past been raced and therefore we cannot offer you a policy at this time. This kind of caught me off guard a little bit. I am sure my name is posted on lots of autox results lists and that is where they sourced it from. Still kinda shocked me. I am an SCCA member, and autox is not W2W and generally below 60-65mph....oh well.

Heacock Classic didn't ask about racing, but I brought it up on purpose. They said no problem. I said the car has a roll bar. They said no problem. I asked both questions a second time just to be sure and no problem. They claim to understand that performance cars are meant to be occassionally driven hard in a controlled atmosphere. They also said that there is no coverage in effect while I am at a racing event as a registered participant and the vehicle is moving under its own power. So if I am motoring through the pits and get T-boned, too bad. If I am pushing the car or towing the car through the pits and get T-boned, they cut the check. So that sounded good enough for me, as I never expected coverage while participating in an autox or at the track. Of course while on public roads I have full coverage. So for $250 a year with full coverage and a $10k agreed upon value I am good to go.

Nothing earth shattering, but just tidbits of info for those that might be in a similar situation. Also, remember that the internet and google can be a double edged sword. Careful what you post on youtube, what shows up on results lists if you are campaigning a street driven car in a race series or event. Lots of information is out there and apparently everyone is watching.

Chris

This post has been edited by 1qwikbird: Jan 27 2010, 02:09 AM

Sounds interesting. Did the cost of insuring your truck go up much for not having the multi-car discount? Either way I'm sure you're saving enough money on the Firebird's insurance to make up the difference.

Multi-car discount was $87. But I was paying $464 a year on the Firechicken, liability only. So I am way ahead of the game for the coverage I now have. I dropped full coverage on the Firechicken 2 years ago because the cost was at least double, maybe triple the $464 figure. It was crazy and I have a perfect record. So this is a much better way to go and more closely fits how I use the car.

Chris