 Speed World Challenge ... |
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 Jun 27 2004, 02:21 AM
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#1
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Advanced Member  Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99  |
... tomorrow (Sunday) from Mid-Ohio. Same day coverage, just time delayed. 1pm EDT, I believe.
My team, #99 Tiger Racing, qualified 5th today just .2 seconds behind Heinricy in the 3rd CTS-V. Go Team. Here's me getting the driver ready at the Sebring race this past March (IMG:http://99chevy.com/multimedia/sebring_2004/gallery_1/images/P1010033.jpg) Speed World Challenge |
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Jun 27 2004, 02:25 AM
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#2
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CMCer Group: Moderators Posts: 2,932 Joined: 12-February 04 From: the sticks near VIR Member No.: 194 |
Is that Tom Oates? I got to meet him when my friend Don Campbell was running a Vette in World Challenge last year at Sears Point. Really nice guy, and I like the tiger theme!
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Jun 27 2004, 02:27 AM
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#3
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
yep, that's Tom. The whole crew is a great bunch.
Here's another shot of us from Sebring. That's Tim coming in from the other side of the car. (IMG:http://99chevy.com/multimedia/sebring_2004/gallery_1/images/P1010029.jpg) |
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Jun 27 2004, 02:30 AM
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#4
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CMCer Group: Moderators Posts: 2,932 Joined: 12-February 04 From: the sticks near VIR Member No.: 194 |
Too cool! I wish you guys luck!!!
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Jun 27 2004, 02:41 AM
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#5
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
QUOTE (PF Flyer @ Jun 26 2004, 08:21 PM) Here's me getting the driver ready at the Sebring race this past March (IMG:http://99chevy.com/multimedia/sebring_2004/gallery_1/images/P1010033.jpg) [/URL] Getting the driver ready? Looks like you have your hands on your hips checking out the babe next to the hauler. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) |
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Jun 27 2004, 02:51 AM
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#6
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 166 Joined: 25-December 03 From: nYc Member No.: 39 |
I didn't even notice the "babe" (grrr...) until you mentioned that. By the way Mitch, I think Mike is the bearded man kneeling down.
Good luck Tiger Team, I'll be watching you guys on tape later tomorrow. ...just noticed the 3-D effect on the stripes. Schweet. |
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Jun 27 2004, 02:53 AM
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#7
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
I noticed that air brushing as well ... or is that a graphic? Whatever it is it's damned nice for a privateer race team. Looks great. |
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Jun 27 2004, 04:20 AM
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#8
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
COOL! Looks like Tom has STEPPED IT UP BIG TIME THIS YEAR!!!
...good luck!....and tell him NOT to pull a Gigliotti on the start! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) |
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Jun 27 2004, 12:06 PM
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#9
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
... that's young Adam checkin out the babe. He attends Penn State but is able to make it to most races. He's a good kid.
Tom does alright as a priveteer. He owns Tom Oates Chevrolet in Chester Springs, PA and has been racing since the early 90's. Even ran Motorola Cup with Heinricy at Daytona back in 95/96? Thanx for the support, I'm hoping they do well today, too. Being 'Rookie of the Year' last year, he's working his way up this year, learning the new car. Tom knows this track fairly well, as he's spent some time on the Podium here during the Runoffs. |
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Jun 27 2004, 07:13 PM
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#10
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
Well, it went OK until he and Culver gathered it up.
How 'bout that Heinrocket in that 3rd CTS-V? Congrats to all the finishers. |
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Jun 27 2004, 08:18 PM
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#11
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FRRAX Owner/Admin Group: Admin Posts: 15,432 Joined: 13-February 04 From: Ohio Member No.: 196 |
It was a great race. I went through several rolls of film (but am without a slide scanner for the moment). I should pick them up tomorrow.
Mike, I asked someone on the team, if you made it this week, one of the guys told me that you couldn't make it (but said you called him this morning...not sure who I spoke to, but you may know). |
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Jun 28 2004, 12:20 AM
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#12
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
It was an OK race ... not a lot of passing ...
It was comforting to know that those pesky Porsche cars get in other people's way as well. I bet Tom was biting the steering wheel ... Gigliotti has his splitter and nose knocked off in the turn one incident. So, everytime he got up on Archer's tail, the car picked up a HUGE push. At least he was in front of thaose Caddys .... Notice the Saleen walk away from the Caddy on a straight? Come on ... sandbagging at it's most obvious. |
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Jun 28 2004, 12:30 AM
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#13
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 27 2004, 06:20 PM) It was an OK race ... not a lot of passing ... It was comforting to know that those pesky Porsche cars get in other people's way as well. I bet Tom was biting the steering wheel ... Gigliotti has his splitter and nose knocked off in the turn one incident. So, everytime he got up on Archer's tail, the car picked up a HUGE push. At least he was in front of thaose Caddys .... Notice the Saleen walk away from the Caddy on a straight? Come on ... sandbagging at it's most obvious. ....gotta agree with you there....OK race....not much going on..... Can't believe that you believe the Caddy's are still sandbagging though... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) ....they BARELY qualified in the top 10....with a PROPERY classed car AND their budget, they should be TOP 5 EVERY WEEKEND! Lou himself OUTDRAGGED ANGELLELI ON THE RESTART and made him look like he was in my LOWLY ITE car! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) Just what do you think their PLAN is????? Lose EVERY race while Audi wins again and again and bring in 15 ringers on the last race???? It is the Audi's that I CONTINUE to be dissappointed with...they have been champion for a billion years in a row, and CONTINUE TO DOMINATE EVERY RACE THIS YEAR, and we STILL we hear about Caddy! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) WHEN WILL WE SEE SOMEONE ADDRESS AUDI????? |
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Jun 28 2004, 12:32 AM
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#14
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 647 Joined: 30-December 03 From: Paris, Texas Member No.: 74 |
I enjoyed the race...except I am sick of those Audi's.
Tom Oates was doing very well until the mishap. I wondered if Lou got damage in the turn one banging. |
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Jun 28 2004, 12:41 AM
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#15
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 440 Joined: 25-December 03 From: Newport Beach, California Member No.: 41 |
i was really hoping for Heinrocket to at least split the Audis up... oh well, there are still plenty of races left
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Jun 28 2004, 12:51 AM
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#16
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Scaring slow F body drivers with a VW diesel Group: Member Posts: 449 Joined: 23-June 04 From: Mt Gilead, Ohio Member No.: 376 |
I agree, good race. Axoid and I watched from above the pits. It was funny to see all the Audi and Caddy team guys watching the monitors.
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Jun 28 2004, 01:38 AM
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#17
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
Randy ... I call it a martyr ... come on, getting out run down the long straight by a Saleen?
Sorry, I don't buy it ... I rev my car tighter than that ... and I'm an old man! |
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Jun 28 2004, 02:09 AM
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#18
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
Kevin, that would of been Chris, the crew chief and car builder.
The other Caddies had the weight penalties, Heinricy didn't, that's why the poduim finish. John has such a history at this track and as a GM engineer, several tons of seat time. He engineered on the F-Bodies, the C4 & 5 & (probably) 6, the CTS-V's and so much more. He and Jon Moss got a lot done for GM over the years. And it was great to see John Young pull on the straights. He's a bit gun shy at times that's why he got shoved out of the way in 'Thunder Valley'. Next race is Infineon July 17th, then Portland. |
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Jun 28 2004, 02:24 AM
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#19
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
Young's car pulling the caddy was jaw dropping after seeing them at Sebring and LRP ...
300lbs can't swing things THAT much, can it? It was TOO much ... |
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Jun 28 2004, 03:18 AM
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#20
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FRRAX Owner/Admin Group: Admin Posts: 15,432 Joined: 13-February 04 From: Ohio Member No.: 196 |
QUOTE (PF Flyer @ Jun 27 2004, 09:09 PM) Kevin, that would of been Chris, the crew chief and car builder. Ahhh...younger guy, small build, light hair? I've got a few pics of LG's car after the race. It was missing some of the door, the front end and such. I didn't see why, but it has a "doughnut" on the drivers door and some door skin missing. I stopped by the pits, but Lou had just left to catch a flight. One of these days I'll meet him....maybe. |
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Jun 28 2004, 03:49 AM
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#21
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 27 2004, 07:38 PM) Randy ... I call it a martyr ... come on, getting out run down the long straight by a Saleen? Sorry, I don't buy it ... I rev my car tighter than that ... and I'm an old man! Young's car pulling the caddy was jaw dropping after seeing them at Sebring and LRP ... 300lbs can't swing things THAT much, can it? It was TOO much ... Mitch... UNLIKE the minor 100 lb. weight penalty to the Audis, Caddy got hit WITH MUCH MORE AFTER SEBRING....not only did they gain the weight, they lost 30% of their throttle body and had a MUCH LOWER rev limiter put on, and had to run a MUCH LESS efficient tranny.....that WOULD EASILY explain why you think you can OUTREV them....you PROBABLY CAN! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) Try putting on a 30mm throttle body next track day and lets see how your times do.... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) I think the move against Caddy at the time was right, but I think it is OBVIOUS at this point it has SEVERELY hampered their dominance! I mean a Caddy WITH NO REWARDS WEIGHT CAN'T TOUCH AUDI's WITH TWO RACES OF PODIUM FINISHES...Heinracy IS A GREAT DRIVER! The Audi's had no problem with him he DROVE THE CRAP out of the car to reach them at the end when their tires died.... THE QUESTION IS....WHY USE KID GLOVES ON THE AUDI...WHY NOT HAMMER THEM LIKE THE CADDY....AT LEAST THEN ALL THE PRIVATEERS WILL BE ABLE TO ANNOUNCE OPEN SEASON ON FACTORY TEAMS.....it will be THE END of the factory teams if they get beat with their big budgets, but maybe that is what some people want.... I also don't get how anybody can think Caddy would sandbag to a 9th and 10th place finish????? Can you explain that to me???? If Culver, Oates and a few others hadn't had "issues" the Caddies would have been 9-10..... |
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Jun 28 2004, 03:50 AM
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#22
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 27 2004, 07:38 PM) Randy ... I call it a martyr ... come on, getting out run down the long straight by a Saleen? Sorry, I don't buy it ... I rev my car tighter than that ... and I'm an old man! ...oh, and the Saleen has the most straightaway speed OF ANY SPEED GT CAR according to insiders... |
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Jun 28 2004, 11:54 AM
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#23
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FRRAX Owner/Admin Group: Admin Posts: 15,432 Joined: 13-February 04 From: Ohio Member No.: 196 |
Audi was banned (the highest award for technical achievement) from road racing in some classes many years ago.....Hmmmm. (not that I want them to leave, competition is good, maybe add some equality)
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Jun 28 2004, 12:30 PM
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#24
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
OK a restirctor on the TB, lowered the rev limiter to "just " 7K and made them run a more conventional trans ... OK
Why are the Audi's REQUIRED to run a production based engine? Why are the Vettes REQUIRED to run a production based engine? Whay are the Vipers REQUIRED to run a productiona based engine? When was the last time you saw a Caddy CTS with a 427 C5R motor? or anything that resembled it? Given the Northstar base and the barn door aero of a CTS, Caddy wouldn't stand a chance. GM bought the chance and there are a lot of SCCA tech officials driving new "evaluation" CTSs. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Now, why are Audi's handled with kid gloves? Speed "World" Challenge ... no other import manufacturer supports for the series. There is a token Porsche ... but he's a privateer ... It's business ...not racing. I don't like it, but I like even less the blind eye SCCA seemingly give a select few. |
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Jun 28 2004, 12:33 PM
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#25
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FRRAX Owner/Admin Group: Admin Posts: 15,432 Joined: 13-February 04 From: Ohio Member No.: 196 |
I agree with you there. Give Caddy the Z06 (LS6) drivetrain and tell them to "suck it up". I'm suprised to see GM abandon the 'Vette (that it has worked so hard to protect all these years) for the Caddy....
But, I think those Caddys are the ugliest things on the road (the whole product line). So, maybe I'm biased... |
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Jun 28 2004, 01:16 PM
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#26
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 604 Joined: 30-December 03 From: Columbus, OH Member No.: 70 |
Anyone else notice to lone privateer GTO?
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Jun 28 2004, 01:46 PM
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#27
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
Stu Hayner? I drove a GTO ... I can understand why they are an "also ran" ...
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Jun 28 2004, 02:07 PM
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#28
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 Member No.: 138 |
Hi GUys,
It was a really fun race, with my "LG Pro Long Tube Special" Corvette Z06. (shameless plug) My qualifying went bad when my 3 disc clutch gave up on the second lap and started slipping. So I just parked it and took a 10th place qualifying spot. The good thing was that I got a good start and went into turn 1 without losing a spot. At the start, I got hit in the left door in turn one by a BMW that got hit by Phil Mclure. My car turned sidways and I was hit again on the left front by another car and straightened me out. At least I was able to keep going. The damage took away some of my front downforce so the car was a little "Pushy" all race. Even though, I was able to get a run out of turn 1 on Angelelli. He blocked me for 3 for 3 laps but I finally got my nose in on his right rear bumper and made room for my self. I passed him entering turn 2 on the right along the grass. There was just enough room for my car and a sheet of paper but we pulled it off. Then we got a yellow flag for the smoking Viper. On the restart I worked on the McCann Viper's mirrors until he made a mistake, then I got past him. There is no way that a C5 can pass the Viper on the strait unless they mess up the corner before. The Corvette does seem to work better in the corners than the Vipers but they have 8 liters, and that is hard to pass. Then I set my sights on the next two cars. Oat's Corvette and a Porsche. I was catching them by nearly a second a lap and I think that info was passed on to the drivers. The C5 made a low percentage pass attempt and they hit each other and spun. This put me in 5th chasing the Viper of Tommy Archer. I was catching him by 1/2 sec per lap, I set the 4th fastest time of the race, at a 1:29.805, ( the fastest lap of the race was a 1:29.657) but as they say, Catching and passing are two different things. I made some gallant tries but could not pull it off without crashing us both. So I settled for a 5th place. All the while I had Angelelli just 2 seconds behind me, just waiting for me to make a mistake. As for the Caddy and Audi domination? Well put it this way. There has not been another make of car on the podium all season. Were it not for the Audi, holding back and controlling the pace to just finish ahead of the Caddy, then the Caddy with no rewards weight of Heinricy would have left the field. So there is still work for SCCA to do to get the cars equal at their base weight, then the rewards weight will do it's job and let any make car able to win on any day. That is their goal, and their mission. I could only pull 1 car length on the Caddy of Angelelli who had 120 pounds of rewards weight. that is like carrying your girlfriend with you during the race, and they were still FAST. The Corvette is supposed to be the "Baseline". So we have to wait for the SCCA to pull the Caddy and Audi down to our level or let us do some work to the Corvette to step up our performance. Until then, we will do what we can to stay up in the fight. Next race is Sears point on July 18th. Hope to see some of you there. Good to see the interest in the Speed World Challenge here. Thanks, Lou Gigliotti LGM (IMG:http://www.speedarena.com/gallery/albums//Sportscar/Speed%20GT/2004/01%20Sebring/069.jpg) |
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Jun 28 2004, 02:34 PM
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#29
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FRRAX Owner/Admin Group: Admin Posts: 15,432 Joined: 13-February 04 From: Ohio Member No.: 196 |
Lou, glad to have you drop in. It's always nice to hear what happened from the guy behind the wheel.
I stopped by the pits to say hello and just missed you. That hit you took in the door looked like a rough one (by looking at the car). Glad to see that the damage had "minimal" impact on the performance of your Corvette. There is definately interest in the WC cars, at least around here. |
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Jun 28 2004, 02:36 PM
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#30
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
Randy, I just read your posts on SCCAProracing.
I now understand your rant better ... Tough break for the Tom Oates ... Glad Lou finally got a whole race in ... although the the start could've been better ... Were you talking with Louis or something? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Why were the Vette's chosen as a baseline? Just lucky? Also Kevin Chambers was doing OK ... till he decided to park and watch for a lap or 2 ... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) |
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Jun 28 2004, 03:17 PM
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#31
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Apex? What apex? Group: Advanced Members Posts: 245 Joined: 7-January 04 From: Portland, OR Member No.: 106 |
Well i missed the race (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) (maybe it is time for cable TV)
Lou, are you comign to the PIR race in a few weeks, being as i don't have cable, and i hardly watch TV, my best chance to get to see you and the vette run, would be at PIR. |
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 Jun 28 2004, 04:10 PM
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#32
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 194 Joined: 23-February 04 From: Plano'l Texas Member No.: 244 |
Mike, Kevin Mixon (Tom's friend from T1) here glad to meet you this weekend. Too bad about Culver. Tom was holding his own out there. Good showing for the team. Angela was hot! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
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Jun 28 2004, 04:38 PM
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#33
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 Member No.: 138 |
Yes,
We will be at Sears and PIR next month. Hope to see you there. The vette was chosen as the baseline just because they wanted that level of performance, and they felt it was not going to be too hard to bring the other cars down to the level of the C5. In reality, trying to manage a 4 wheel drive twin turbo, with adjustable torque bias front to rear, is harder than they thought. And with the Caddy, they let them go too far in the beginning with a C5R block and destroked crank with a 90mm tb and big manifold, the engine was moved back 12" from the stock location and the transmission is 22" back from stock. That is why the Cadillac is so hard to make equal since it is not in line with the other cars in the class. and add to that a 4 wheel drive twin Turbo Audi and you have a mess on your hands at SCCA. At any rate, we are going racing and we will do whatever we can to make it interesting. Thanks Lou G |
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Jun 28 2004, 05:21 PM
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#34
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CMCer Group: Moderators Posts: 2,932 Joined: 12-February 04 From: the sticks near VIR Member No.: 194 |
I'm hoping to make Sears and watch you guys. Any way you could swing a pit pass or two for the local gal here? PM me if at all possible.
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Jun 28 2004, 05:56 PM
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#35
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 28 2004, 06:30 AM) OK a restirctor on the TB, lowered the rev limiter to "just " 7K and made them run a more conventional trans ... OK Why are the Audi's REQUIRED to run a production based engine? Why are the Vettes REQUIRED to run a production based engine? Whay are the Vipers REQUIRED to run a productiona based engine? When was the last time you saw a Caddy CTS with a 427 C5R motor? or anything that resembled it? Given the Northstar base and the barn door aero of a CTS, Caddy wouldn't stand a chance. GM bought the chance and there are a lot of SCCA tech officials driving new "evaluation" CTSs. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Now, why are Audi's handled with kid gloves? Speed "World" Challenge ... no other import manufacturer supports for the series. There is a token Porsche ... but he's a privateer ... It's business ...not racing. I don't like it, but I like even less the blind eye SCCA seemingly give a select few. ....now THERE you have something I can agree with Mitch....Caddy should have NEVER been given so much, so soon as they were in developing that car....in fact, I was on the Speedvision website bitching about this very issue when I FIRST saw the photos back in Nov/Dec last year.....They SHOULD be running production based stuff just like everyone else! But THAT was not your point....your point was Caddy sandbagging...I think that is a little far flung. I also don't get the conspiracy theorist comments from all the folks who have all SCCA driving new Caddies....STILL WAITING FOR MINE (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/mad.gif) ...I think the SCCA got HOODWINKED good by REALLY WANTING CADDY IN THE SERIES, and bent over backward for them, but WHAT did Caddy PAY FOR???? Upper mid pack finishes??? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) Caddy got one over on the SCCA FOR SURE....and the car was NOT built the way it should have been....BUT, they were HAMMERED after the Sebring race, and HAVE NOT been the same since. My question is Audi is OUTPERFORMING EVERYONE....much less the Caddies....WHY HASN"T THE HAMMER COME OUT ON THEM....and if SCCA is worried about losing the "world" title....how about AT LEAST a rubber mallet???? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) |
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Jun 28 2004, 06:03 PM
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#36
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (LG Motorsports @ Jun 28 2004, 10:38 AM) Yes, We will be at Sears and PIR next month. Hope to see you there. The vette was chosen as the baseline just because they wanted that level of performance, and they felt it was not going to be too hard to bring the other cars down to the level of the C5. In reality, trying to manage a 4 wheel drive twin turbo, with adjustable torque bias front to rear, is harder than they thought. And with the Caddy, they let them go too far in the beginning with a C5R block and destroked crank with a 90mm tb and big manifold, the engine was moved back 12" from the stock location and the transmission is 22" back from stock. That is why the Cadillac is so hard to make equal since it is not in line with the other cars in the class. and add to that a 4 wheel drive twin Turbo Audi and you have a mess on your hands at SCCA. At any rate, we are going racing and we will do whatever we can to make it interesting. Thanks Lou G Hey Lou, Thanks for dropin' by and lettin' us know what is up! I ALREADY have my passes for the Sears Point race.....if only my lowly ITE car could run with you guys and me not get run over and killed in the process... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) See you there! |
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Jun 28 2004, 06:20 PM
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#37
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 194 Joined: 23-February 04 From: Plano'l Texas Member No.: 244 |
Lou, Good strong run! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I thought you were going to get Archer. Any lap times? It looked like you had him every lap and he was holding you up a bit. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)
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Jun 28 2004, 06:36 PM
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#38
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Video Clip God Group: Advanced Members Posts: 155 Joined: 7-January 04 From: Ontario Member No.: 105 |
I agree with most of what's being said about the politics of WC racing... I'm skeptical on the sandbagging but as we all know, if you don't get caught it's not cheating. Tho sandbagging, as the Caddies or Audi's both may be doing, isn't directly cheating it gives the same impact. It's just not quite as ethical in a racer perspective(not that cheating is either but i'd rather be caught cheating than sandbagging).Either way it's not something that will continue for more than a race or two max I would assume. What driver would have fun doing that?!?!
On the brighter side, good run Lou, even with that turn 1 entanglement you got trapped into! Tell them speedvision bastards to pan the camera once awhile! Sure would be nice to see what's happening outside of the top 3. Lastly Lou, you need to get one of those cockpit cams for broadcast going in your LG C5R(I can't rmember the rest of your plug right now)!!! That beast has one mean soundin motor! |
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Jun 28 2004, 09:02 PM
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#39
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 Member No.: 138 |
Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course, Lexington, Ohio
SCCA SPEED GT Championship Round Three Results with fast lap Fn St # Driver/Hometown Sponsor/Car Pt Purse Lp Gap Fast Time Speed 1 1 2 Michael Galati/N. Olmsted/OH Audi Certified Pre-Owned/Audi RS 6 Comp 34 13000 24 1:29.801 90.52 2 2 1 Randy Pobst/Gainesville/GA Audi Certified Pre-Owned/Audi RS 6 Comp 28 7700 24 -0.249 1:29.647 90.68 3 4 12 John Heinricy/Holly/MI Cadillac/Mobil 1/Motorola/Bose/Cadillac CTS-V 26 3000 24 -0.777 1:29.672 90.65 4 7 22 Tommy Archer/Duluth/MN 3R-Racing/c3controls/Viper CompCoupe 23 2800 24 -8.764 1:30.470 89.85 5 10 28 Lou Gigliotti/Dallas/TX LG Pro Long Tube Header/Corvette Z06 21 1700 24 -10.412 1:29.805 90.52 6 9 16 Max Angelelli/Monte Carlo/MC Cadillac/Mobil 1/Motorola/Bose/Cadillac CTS-V 20 1400 24 -12.467 1:30.354 89.97 7 12 8 Andy Pilgrim/Delray Beach/FL Cadillac/Mobil 1/Motorola/Bose/Cadillac CTS-V 19 1800 24 -20.815 1:30.626 89.70 8 16 44 John Young/Woodside/CA Apex Racing/Saleen SR 18 1200 24 -22.607 1:30.054 90.27 9 6 82 Mike McCann®/Canton/OH McCann Plastics/Viper CompCoupe 17 2100 24 -30.888 1:30.678 89.64 10 18 92 Stan Wilson®/Mt. Juliet/TN Carbotech/Viper CompCoupe 16 2000 24 -31.333 1:31.479 88.86 11 15 34 Tony Gaples/Lake Forest/IL Black Dog Racing/Corvette Z06 15 800 24 -34.377 1:31.459 88.88 12 5 99 Thomas Oates/Chester Springs/PA Tiger Racing/Corvette Z06 15 700 24 -34.926 1:30.530 89.79 13 14 83 Jim McCann®/Canton/OH McCann Plastics/Viper CompCoupe 13 600 24 -49.844 1:32.500 87.88 14 3 14 Michael Culver/Westport/CT First Racing/Porsche 911 Cup 13 650 24 -50.112 1:30.166 90.15 15 25 5 Stu Hayner/Yorba Linda/CA GMAC Cmrl Fin/Trenton Forging/Pontiac GTO 11 600 24 -56.933 1:32.814 87.58 16 17 65 Jon Groom/Boonton/NJ AXA/Porsche 911 Cup 10 450 24 -58.235 1:31.226 89.11 17 23 81 Sonny Whelen®/Old Saybrook/CT Whelen Engineering/Dodge Viper 9 400 24 -58.63 1:32.692 87.70 18 20 56 Rich Marziale®/Tempe/AZ /Viper CompCoupe 8 375 24 -1:02.68 1:32.627 87.76 19 28 53 Mike Hartley®/Cherry Hill/NJ Dezigns Inc./Dodge Viper GTS 7 350 24 -1:12.64 1:34.102 86.38 20 27 51 Lenny Diller®/Garden City/NY King Cole Audio Visual/Viper CompCoupe 6 300 24 -1:13.037 1:33.445 86.99 21 29 76 John Bourassa/Jupiter Island/FL TeamHurricane Rcng/DiamondStar/Porsche 911 T 5 24 -1:19.504 1:33.676 86.78 22 19 6 Leighton Reese/Minnetonka/MN Banner Engineering/Corvette Z06 4 24 -1:23.948 1:32.888 87.51 23 33 02 Adel Elsayed/Boonton/NJ Brisar Delvco/Automoblox/Viper CompCoupe 3 23 -1 laps 1:35.325 85.274 24 24 67 Kevin Chambers/Menlo Park/CA Portola Valley Training Center/Corvette Z06 2 20 -4 laps 1:32.111 88.250 25 8 13 Bob Woodhouse®/Blair/NE Woodhouse Auto Family/Viper CompCoupe 1 19 -5 laps 1:31.361 88.974 26 32 10 Carol Hollfelder/Covina/CA Ford Advanced Powertrain/Ford Mustang 14 Mech. 1:35.009 85.558 27 30 9 Adam Malmquist®/Chicago/IL Pepsi Cola/Douog Rippie Mtrspt/Corvette 12 Mech. 1:33.721 86.734 28 21 33 Tim Wiens/Westminster/CO 1st Interstate Inns/3R-Racing/Viper CompCoupe 4 Engine 1:32.641 87.745 29 22 21 Jameson Riley/Wilton/CT McMillin Mtsprts/Riley Mtsprts/BMW M3 4 Mech. 1:32.356 88.016 30 31 03 Warren Diller®/Garden City/NY Kin Cole Audio Visual/Dodge ViperComp 3 Mech. 1:35.137 85.443 31 13 73 Phil McClure/Floris/IA Aggregate Industries/3R-Racing/Corvette Z06 1 Crash no time 32 11 20 Jeff McMillin/Erie/PA JJ's Snacks/Red Line Oil/BMW M3 0 Wheel no time 33 26 31 Keith Videtto®/San Ramon/CA KEV Inc./LG Por Long Tube Hdrs/Corvette Z06 0 Mech. no time Updated - 06/27/2004 |
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Jun 28 2004, 09:08 PM
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#40
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
We do agree ... Caddy was given too much and Audi is hands off ... why? I dunno ....
Randy, I guess my issue about "sandbagging" boils down to a couple of points ... I believe Cadillac had 2 major objectives for the 2004 season ... win the first race they fielded cars and win the season manufacturer's championship. Fielding a 3rd car got them another podium (more manufacturer's points and running mid pack will get some rewards points relief. Like any other team, they are reading the rules and using the rules to their advantage. I also believe, like most every other series, a certain amount of drama draws attention. And I think the SCCA is playing the fans both on the track and off track battle. In any drama, there are those who pull for the good guys and those who cheer the bad guys. I'm not saying either side (pro caddy/Audi or anti-caddy/audi) is the good guy or the bad guy ... just making a distinction between 2 camps. And that distinction is what will draw media coverage, which equates to attendance and ratings. Looking back at the race, how much TV coverage did Stu get for coming up so far in the standings? How much coverage did Archer/Gigliotti get for their battle? Very, very little ... the Audis and the Caddys stole the show ... even from 9th and 10th place, they got airtime. And being in the media biz, it's all about airtime, brother ... while listening to a scanner one time, I heard Ken Schrader ask if he should blow up the motor, in the closing laps of a Texas race, so Skoal could get a little more air time. It happens ... |
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Jun 28 2004, 09:35 PM
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#41
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
AHA!
Another thing we can agree on....bad TV coverage focusing on just a few cars! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) But I WILL NEVER believe that the Caddys are stragizing (sp/word?) to finish 5th through 10th each and every race ALL THE WHILE AUDI FINISHES 1-2 with the idea that they can win ANYTHING CLOSE to a championship this way.....got some confused GM people if they are thinking this way....'course it wouldn't be THE FIRST time GM engineers got confused.... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) |
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Jun 28 2004, 10:18 PM
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#42
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 Member No.: 138 |
Just remember, if the Audi gets 75 pounds and Caddy takes off 15, that is a 90 pound swing. Then if the Audi get some adjustments for blowing the field away, then you can add that to the mix. Then if Caddy lobbys enough they might get some weight off. The bottom line is that the Caddy will be able to control the outcome for the rest of the season.
Sounds pretty smart to me. LG |
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Jun 28 2004, 10:41 PM
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#43
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
We shall see. I just don't buy conspiracy theories in general...until proven that is! For all I know YOU ARE SANDBAGGING LOU...you qualified outside pole at Sebring didn't ya.....hmmmmmm... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) Just kidding!
I agree with THE WORLD that the Caddies were GIVEN EVERYTHING THEY ASKED FOR AND MORE to start the season....AND, that this was wrong!!! But I just don't see them TRYING to finish in 5th through 10th! They got magazine ads to print to justify all that money they are spending....magazine ads ONLY LOOK GOOD with podium finishes! IF THEY ARE SANDBAGGING, who REALLY CARES if they choose to spend $9 MILLION to finish mid pack....I say DAMN GM....that's $9 Million they COULD have spent on a new Camaro design.... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) I will wait to see them BLOW BY the nearest competitor with ease like they did at Sebring before I jump on their case again....now Audi....hmmmmm....they get NONE of my sympathy....they aren't even a GM product! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) Keep up the good work Lou! |
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Jun 28 2004, 11:21 PM
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#44
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
... wait 'til everyone gets to Road America and has the Viper's to contend with. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)
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Jun 29 2004, 01:58 AM
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#45
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
Way to keep everything in perspective, Mike ...
Randy, you are obviously not a child of the 60s ... |
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Jun 29 2004, 02:15 AM
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#46
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 28 2004, 07:58 PM) Way to keep everything in perspective, Mike ... Randy, you are obviously not a child of the 60s ... I was BORN In the 60's....THAT counts doesn't it???? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) Seriously, I was right in line with you all about the Caddies and how much was wrong on how they were brought into the series. I just can't stand in line when we talk of BIG $$$ intentionally setting the rev limiters down 1000 RPM and throwin' races BADLY...so that they can STORM back in the final races and take the crown from Audi who, AT THIS POINT, looks to smoke their way to 1-2 EVERY race! If for no other reason that Caddy HAS TO SEE THAT Audi is DOMINATING.....we can.....so don't you think they would be looking to finish in 3rd through 5th instead of STRUGGLING to make the top ten??? They are smart enough to know they will need a few more points..... I would BE SO VERY HAPPY to see Vette's and Viper's on the podium the next race! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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Jun 29 2004, 02:25 AM
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#47
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
No ... it doesn't. You were heavy into disco, I can tell. "It's all good, baaabeee."
(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I don't suppose you believe Ferrari team orders to let Micheal win, either ... even though it was plain as day, Barachello lifted and Schumacher was embarrassed. Reubens foot slipped and Michael hit that 500 shot of nitrous ... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) It's all good, baaaabeee ... |
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Jun 29 2004, 02:28 AM
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#48
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
I'm gonna get 5 rockers out of this thread, yet!
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Jun 29 2004, 02:29 AM
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#49
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
LOL ... Randy has over 10% of all posts on this board today.
What do you do for a living again???? |
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Jun 29 2004, 02:49 AM
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#50
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 647 Joined: 30-December 03 From: Paris, Texas Member No.: 74 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 28 2004, 08:28 PM) I'm gonna get 5 rockers out of this thread, yet! You post whore!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) |
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Jun 29 2004, 04:27 AM
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#51
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 28 2004, 08:25 PM) No ... it doesn't. You were heavy into disco, I can tell. "It's all good, baaabeee." (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I don't suppose you believe Ferrari team orders to let Micheal win, either ... even though it was plain as day, Barachello lifted and Schumacher was embarrassed. Reubens foot slipped and Michael hit that 500 shot of nitrous ... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) It's all good, baaaabeee ... I REFUSE to watch F1 any more.....IT IS NOT RACING..... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) |
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Jun 29 2004, 04:28 AM
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#52
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 28 2004, 08:29 PM) LOL ... Randy has over 10% of all posts on this board today. What do you do for a living again???? ...I sit at a computer ALL DAY....with IE on in the background.... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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Jun 29 2004, 04:45 AM
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#53
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 Member No.: 138 |
Just for some information.
At Sebring, the Caddys had a 7900 rev limit. During the race, Angelelli won the race, but only by a scant margin. He only turned a 2:12.9 lap time on the way to the win. But his team mate Pilgrim came from the back of the pack and turned a 2:10.xx time which was faster than his qualifying time. When the SCCA downloaded the Data Acquisition, they did the "Theoretical best lap" using the data and found that Pilgrim could do a 2:07. best lap and did it using only 7000 rpms. SCCA said that if you can do a 210 lap only using 7k then that will be their new limit. And since they turned 3 seconds faster than any car out there, they also got a 100 pound penalty and restrictor. So there had to be a clear decision by the Caddy team to run one car slow. And we all know that if they could have run 1-2, they would have not run the 2:10 lap but they would both have run the 213 fastest lap. This clearly indicaes that they would have run just fast enough to win but not give up track position while at the same time run slow. It may be called Sandbagging but I call it "Planining". LG |
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Jun 29 2004, 06:18 AM
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#54
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
OK....OK....I give up! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)
I will be VERY surprised to see the "Mid Pack Conspiracy" theory work in any way to achieve a Manufacturers Title, but I will agree to all, that we must wait and see. I just hope there will be SOME good racing and I don't have to post a RATHER PUBLIC apology to all those I have scoffed at! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) See Ya at Sears Lou! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) |
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Jun 29 2004, 11:39 AM
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#55
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
... when we were at Sebring, during qualifying, we timed Andy's Caddy, as well as Phil's Vette and our own car. We could see the 1/10 increases each lap until they were told, 'that's enough, you have the pole', just infront of Phil's car.
I see this as the 'Money Pit', coming in with a 'development' that needs real world testing, not just going around the Nurenburgring for days at a time. That was just getting ready for the series. The way these cars are built/engineered, it's un-freaking-believable. Randy, get up close and personal and just look at what's been chopped and channelled and re-engineered. All the way down to the floor pans. The only thing that resembles stock on those cars is the Caddy emblem. Anyone read Smokey Yunick's book? |
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Jun 29 2004, 12:38 PM
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#56
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
I guess Randy's ire is more directed at "Why not the Audi's as well."
Understandable ... I like the fact that privateers like Tom and Lou can build cars and compete. And compete on a level playing field. |
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Jun 29 2004, 02:10 PM
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#57
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
... I believe that the next race will be an 'eye opener'.
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Jun 29 2004, 06:15 PM
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#58
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (PF Flyer @ Jun 29 2004, 05:39 AM) ... when we were at Sebring, during qualifying, we timed Andy's Caddy, as well as Phil's Vette and our own car. We could see the 1/10 increases each lap until they were told, 'that's enough, you have the pole', just infront of Phil's car. I see this as the 'Money Pit', coming in with a 'development' that needs real world testing, not just going around the Nurenburgring for days at a time. That was just getting ready for the series. The way these cars are built/engineered, it's un-freaking-believable. Randy, get up close and personal and just look at what's been chopped and channelled and re-engineered. All the way down to the floor pans. The only thing that resembles stock on those cars is the Caddy emblem. Anyone read Smokey Yunick's book? Damn you guys....you drew me out again... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) Couple of things... FIRST AND FOREMOST, although I have not seen the Caddies up close, I have seen enough pics to know they are WAY BEYOND the spirit of the rules of WC. I was one of the FIRST to rip the SCCA for allowing the Caddies on the WC website back in December. My point has been, "OK...we let them in....bad move, but, now lets deal with them and bring them to the other cars performance wise." I keep hearing "when we were at Sebring" (from everybody...not just you) "you should have SEEN THESE THINGS FLY!" Well Sebring was a while ago, and IMO substantial changes/penalties were made to the car. IT IS NOT THE SAME CAR, SO THESE OBSERVATIONS ALTHOUGH TRUE HAVE NO BEARING NOW. I have also heard MATHMATICAL calculations as to how the Caddies can go DOUBLE DIGIT under lap records if they so choose. OK, fine, but that IS NOT what we are seeing....WHEN will I see these lap times??? I CANNOT believe the "strategy" of finishing mid pack to win a championship....ESPECIALLY if Audi is gonna KEEP FINISHING 1-2....I CAN BELIEVE Audi's apparent strategy....go JUST FAST ENOUGH to stay in the front and NO MORE....now THAT is a strategy I KNOW IS BEING USED! QUOTE ... I believe that the next race will be an 'eye opener'. I have also heard this EVERY race now....yet THE ONLY eye opener is that the Caddies fall further back in the pack....I know, I know.....it is THEIR STRATEGY DUMMY (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) I just am not getting it.....THE FIRST TIME I SEE A CADDY HAVE AN AUDI LIKE PERFORMANCE I WILL BE RIGHT BACK WITH YOU GUYS, BUT AS LONG AS THEY FINISH MID PACK, THEY ARE EITHER BEING HELD IN CHECK, OR SANDBAGGING....BUT WHO CARES??? When you got privateers finishing in front of them EVERY RACE...what is the difference??? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) |
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Jun 29 2004, 06:19 PM
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#59
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
... some in-car video from Tiger Racing is up on their WEBSITE.
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Jun 29 2004, 07:33 PM
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#60
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (PF Flyer @ Jun 29 2004, 12:19 PM) ... some in-car video from Tiger Racing is up on their WEBSITE. NICE VIDEOS! I will say though, at the end of lap one....the Viper is HOUNDING Heinracy....Caddy holding him up.....while...low and behold..... Can't see an Audi for the LIFE OF ME! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) |
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Jun 29 2004, 09:39 PM
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#61
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 Member No.: 138 |
Ok,
Here is the deal. Audi= faster than Caddy at present levels. Caddy faster then everything else at base weight, where Heinricy was Porsche, Viper, Corvette very close, except that the Porsche and Viper are a little light. BMW needs Auberlen or Boris to be as fast as last year Mustang= big power medium driving, but hard to tell if it could be faster. Boris will be in one at Sears point then we will see. Rewards weight skews the curve. The 2 regular Caddys and Audi had over 100 pounds in rewards weight which should caculate to a 1.2 second slower car at Mid O. when in reality the Audi was faster than the unweighted Caddy. So the Audi should come down to the Caddy speed. But were it not for the Audi, the Caddy would have run away with the show, so it needs to come back to the performance levels of the other cars. Forget about where and why they finished 6th and 7th, just keep in mind that the unweighted caddy was just as dominant as the Audi that had 100 pounds of rewards weight. And the Viper only had 60 pounds and the Vettes had NO Weight. An unweighted Vette could not keep up with the unweighted Caddy, period. The answer is that SCCA has a hard job dealing with the factorys. the real answer is that they should beat the factorys down to the point that only a non factory car can win for 3 races to make up for the Audi/Caddy gifts that they were given at Sebring, LR and Mid O. LG |
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Jun 29 2004, 10:09 PM
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#62
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Scaring slow F body drivers with a VW diesel Group: Member Posts: 449 Joined: 23-June 04 From: Mt Gilead, Ohio Member No.: 376 |
Well, we can only hope the SCCA can somehow keep the playing field level. I, for one, would like to see the private teams beating the factory teams.
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Jun 30 2004, 12:06 AM
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#63
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CMCer Group: Moderators Posts: 2,932 Joined: 12-February 04 From: the sticks near VIR Member No.: 194 |
Here here Mericet! Go private guys!
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Jun 30 2004, 02:39 AM
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#64
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (LG Motorsports @ Jun 29 2004, 03:39 PM) Ok, Here is the deal. Audi= faster than Caddy at present levels. Caddy faster then everything else at base weight, where Heinricy was Porsche, Viper, Corvette very close, except that the Porsche and Viper are a little light. BMW needs Auberlen or Boris to be as fast as last year Mustang= big power medium driving, but hard to tell if it could be faster. Boris will be in one at Sears point then we will see. Rewards weight skews the curve. The 2 regular Caddys and Audi had over 100 pounds in rewards weight which should caculate to a 1.2 second slower car at Mid O. when in reality the Audi was faster than the unweighted Caddy. So the Audi should come down to the Caddy speed. But were it not for the Audi, the Caddy would have run away with the show, so it needs to come back to the performance levels of the other cars. Forget about where and why they finished 6th and 7th, just keep in mind that the unweighted caddy was just as dominant as the Audi that had 100 pounds of rewards weight. And the Viper only had 60 pounds and the Vettes had NO Weight. An unweighted Vette could not keep up with the unweighted Caddy, period. The answer is that SCCA has a hard job dealing with the factorys. the real answer is that they should beat the factorys down to the point that only a non factory car can win for 3 races to make up for the Audi/Caddy gifts that they were given at Sebring, LR and Mid O. LG OK....now you're talkin' Lou.....I can agree with that! ESPECIALLY the part where you mention WEIGHTED Audi's being FASTER than UNWEIGHTED Caddys (i.e. Hienracy). Now THAT is just plain wrong for that to be happening! The Audi rewards weight should have kicked in by now.... In short.....Audi should be moved back in some way (boost???) other than weight and rewards weight, as they will WHINE LIKE DOGS that their tires will fall off the car with more weight (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) . I can agree that an unweighted Caddy (again Heinracy) was too fast for the field.....NOT MIND BOGGLING fast like Sebring, but another slight adjustment may be needed to the "base" car. As far as rewards weight affecting the Caddy's, I think it HAS, and if the base was TWEAKED a little....not hammered like last time....the Caddy would be good to go.... Ultra short version: Audi: Fairly major adjustment ON TOP of rewards weight needed. Caddy: Fairly minor adjustment needed to base car. Look forward to seeing you in person back at the front at Sears Lou! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) |
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Jun 30 2004, 11:26 AM
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#65
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 545 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Germantown, MD USA Member No.: 99 |
... 'I love the smell of race gas in the morning'. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)
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Jun 30 2004, 01:00 PM
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#66
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FRRAX Owner/Admin Group: Admin Posts: 15,432 Joined: 13-February 04 From: Ohio Member No.: 196 |
QUOTE (PF Flyer @ Jun 30 2004, 06:26 AM) ... 'I love the smell of race gas in the morning'. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm..... |
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Jun 30 2004, 01:59 PM
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#67
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
octane good ...
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 Jun 30 2004, 02:31 PM
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#68
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 194 Joined: 23-February 04 From: Plano'l Texas Member No.: 244 |
Okay Admit great drivers equal great results.
Audi-Pobst great drivers, lots o' cash (via factory) = podium finishes Caddy-Hienrocket, Pilgrim, Max A, lots o' cash (via factory)= podium finishes Viper-Tommy Archer, lots of sponsor cash = podium finishes Lou G- More talant than cash = some podium finishes Culver- don't know much about him but fast at Mid-O Tommy Oats- mix of talent and cash Vipers, Vettes, Porsches mixed the rest of the field from front to back. O'h and a GTO (sorry Stu) The Mustang has no competition hope in this race. Should be moved to WCT (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) These are my ramblings, but the point is the above mentioned names can do well in any car given seat time and Lots O' Cash. Lou+Caddy=Podium, Tommy Archer+Caddy+podium, Stu Hayner+Caddy=Podium and so on. I can't remeber where I have heard this but: "Where Money Buys Speed" (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) |
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Jun 30 2004, 02:53 PM
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#69
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
LOL ... I've procured a lot of speed there ....
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Jun 30 2004, 05:39 PM
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#70
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jun 30 2004, 08:53 AM) LOL ... I've procured a lot of speed there .... AND.....dropped a lot of MONEY there... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) |
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Jul 3 2004, 03:13 AM
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#71
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Advanced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 382 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Kathmandu, Nepal Member No.: 2 |
I just watched “Cadillac Test Drive, CTS-V” on Speed Channel. In one segment they had Max Angelelli and Andy Pilgrim in the CTS-VR cars and Tommy Kendall in the CTS-V (street version) on the track at Sebring at the same time. Seeing the 2 models side by side from a distance, you would NOT think they were the same car. One looks tall and narrow, while the other looks very wide and low.
As they get closer, you can see that they both have the same “fart and science” styling theme that defines Cadillac today. Pratt and Miller really did a good job of retaining the “look” of the regular V. The VR has all of the jarring asymmetrical origami creases of the street car, similar greenhouse, even appears to have real headlights (or VERY good decals). NASCAR should do so well. But, the silhouettes are just 2 different vehicles. Does anyone know if the WC Vipers and Vettes are chopped and widened any? |
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Jul 3 2004, 04:41 AM
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#72
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
I heard that there were some significant rules changes for everyone ... except the GTO (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)
I just went to www.sccapro.com and clicked on the "Discussion Forums" Anything look funny to anyone? (IMG:http://24.0.108.222/mitchntx/SCCAProBd.jpg) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) |
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Jul 3 2004, 04:53 AM
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#73
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jul 2 2004, 10:41 PM) I heard that there were some significant rules changes for everyone ... except the GTO (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) I just went to www.sccapro.com and clicked on the "Discussion Forums" Anything look funny to anyone? (IMG:http://24.0.108.222/mitchntx/SCCAProBd.jpg) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) WOW!!!!! That is UN...F'ING...BELIEVABLE....!!! They hit the Audi....YEAH! But say Caddy is good, and ALL THE OTHERS GET 20% less air???????????????? WTF???? ....then disable the message board........... that is REALLY hoaky man.... Sorry Lou! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) |
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Jul 3 2004, 04:56 AM
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#74
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
I guess the SCCA web admin staff are out driving their new "evaluation" CTSs as we type ...
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Jul 3 2004, 04:59 AM
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#75
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
I clicked on "Contact" at the bottom and sent Eric this
What happened that stripped the WC forum? The other forums seem to work OK ... Signed A fan, quickly becoming disillusioned with all the politics ... |
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Jul 3 2004, 05:09 AM
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#76
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jul 2 2004, 10:59 PM) I clicked on "Contact" at the bottom and sent Eric this What happened that stripped the WC forum? The other forums seem to work OK ... Signed A fan, quickly becoming disillusioned with all the politics ... ...damn....all this time I have been defending SCCA and the goings on against the two "unreasonable" Caddy complaints: 1. Caddy Sandbagging 2. Caddy conspiracy to "own" the series IN MY WILDEST IMAGINATION, I WOULD NEVER HAVE THOUGHT I WOULD BE PROVEN WRONG ON THE CONSPIRACY SIDE OF THINGS!!!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) In the back of my mind I thought....OK....Caddy ****MIGHT**** do something to make it "LOOK" like they were sandbagging and I will have to defend my points, but this move by the SCCA STINKS OF SOME REAL OFFENSIVE "decision" making.... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) EVEN I GOT TO ADMIT......THIS JUST HANDS CADDY THE UPPER HAND IN SO MANY WAYS!!!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) Hell....maybe I better complain since Caddy is OBVIOUSLY handing SCCA so much money my GODDAMN ENTRY FEES should go down eh????? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) SICK man.....JUST SICK! |
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Jul 3 2004, 05:15 AM
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#77
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Insert catch phrase here Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,098 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Michigan Member No.: 20 |
For those of you looking for the details on the rules updates - http://www.world-challenge.com/news/04press96.html
Yep, I'm glad I'm just an amateur wannabe racer. If I had a large budget sunk into a team changes like this would throw me and my budget for a loop I'm sure. I have no idea why they would hit everyone with handicaps instead of just trying to even out the playing field by going after the ones that are dominating the series. |
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Jul 3 2004, 05:19 AM
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#78
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Insert catch phrase here Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,098 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Michigan Member No.: 20 |
QUOTE (rmackintosh @ Jul 3 2004, 01:09 AM) IN MY WILDEST IMAGINATION, I WOULD NEVER HAVE THOUGHT I WOULD BE PROVEN WRONG ON THE CONSPIRACY SIDE OF THINGS!!!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) I hightly doubt there's a conspiracy to have Caddy dominate the series. SCCA made a mistake letting Caddy into the WC with their huge changes from the street car and they realized it. They have rendered the Caddy uncompetitive until this change, and the jury's still out on the end effect of this change. Notice, they hit the Audi on many fronts - rpm limit, weight, and turbo boost. Only Heinricy's Caddy did well at Mid Ohio. With these changes I'm sure it would have dominated that race, but then it would instantly get hit with weight, just like the other Caddys that are now mid pack runners. |
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Jul 3 2004, 05:46 AM
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#79
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (94bird @ Jul 2 2004, 11:19 PM) QUOTE (rmackintosh @ Jul 3 2004, 01:09 AM) IN MY WILDEST IMAGINATION, I WOULD NEVER HAVE THOUGHT I WOULD BE PROVEN WRONG ON THE CONSPIRACY SIDE OF THINGS!!!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) I hightly doubt there's a conspiracy to have Caddy dominate the series. SCCA made a mistake letting Caddy into the WC with their huge changes from the street car and they realized it. They have rendered the Caddy uncompetitive until this change, and the jury's still out on the end effect of this change. Notice, they hit the Audi on many fronts - rpm limit, weight, and turbo boost. Only Heinricy's Caddy did well at Mid Ohio. With these changes I'm sure it would have dominated that race, but then it would instantly get hit with weight, just like the other Caddys that are now mid pack runners. Mike, Your points ARE EXACTLY MY POINTS.....from ****yesterday**** (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) But the Caddy Base was STILL able to catch the Audis at the end of the last race.....some would say that without the crazy long yellow, and shortened race....the Audi's tires were DONE, and Caddy would have WALKED AWAY WITH IT..... WHERE DOES THAT LEAVE THE SERIES.....penalize EVERYBODY BUT CADDY????? uh un.....NO WAY! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/mad.gif) |
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Jul 3 2004, 06:08 AM
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#80
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Insert catch phrase here Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,098 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Michigan Member No.: 20 |
Like I said. Only Heinricy's "base" Caddy was competitive in that race. As soon as he wins a race he won't be "base" anymore. He'll be just like the other mid-pack running Caddys. Keep in mind that was Heinricy driving too. Pairing his experience with these cars and Mid Ohio makes him Caddy's attempt to show SCCA the Audis were unbeatable even if Caddy threw everything they had at them. It appears to have worked.
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Jul 3 2004, 12:38 PM
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#81
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
But Mike, realize, all this dancing going on, in an attempt to "level the playing field" is burning up the season.
So Audi's get weight and less boost. Vipers and Vette's get a HUGE restrictor. The base Caddy could hang with them (Heinricy) and Angelelli and Pilgrim now are back to that base. I don't see how this is leveling the field. Disabling the discussion mechanism was just too obvious. You might not believe in conspiracies just like I don't believe in coinidences. |
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Jul 3 2004, 03:50 PM
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#82
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 Member No.: 138 |
A 20% restrictor will take away about 50 hp. The goal of SCCA is to make it so that each car at it's base weight would be equal. These changes will bring the Audi down to below the Caddy, and relegate the rest of the field to also rans. We will be Soybean filler in the Cadillac feast.
The Audi with rewards weight should not have won Mid Ohio. The Caddy of Heinricy should have only been able to run equal with a Corvette with no rewards weight. But he and the Audi ran away from the field. I was only able to keep Angelelli a few car lengths back even though he had 120# of rewards weight. That was about right although if I had that same 120# weight, te Caddy would have ran away from me. So that shows that the caddy was still above the Vette. The 1% rear weight reduction is equal to taking 15 pounds of te rear and putting it on te front. So you really think that will do very much? If my team mates were not from the Sears Pt area, we would not even go to the race. I want to race, not just go to try to get a 5th place which is the top anyone will reach unless te Caddy or Audi break. I think that they have made an error. One that might impact the credibility of the series forever, unless they reverse this decision. As a side note, they are essentially giving the GTO a 50hp boost because they did not do their homework. They have the same engine, weight and tire as us but they are not making the same hp, but not because it is not there, but because they didn't do their homework. What a bad decision. The net result is that Caddys will win every race that they want, regardless of their rewards weight. LG |
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Jul 3 2004, 04:32 PM
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#83
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (LG Motorsports @ Jul 3 2004, 09:50 AM) A 20% restrictor will take away about 50 hp. The goal of SCCA is to make it so that each car at it's base weight would be equal. These changes will bring the Audi down to below the Caddy, and relegate the rest of the field to also rans. We will be Soybean filler in the Cadillac feast. The Audi with rewards weight should not have won Mid Ohio. The Caddy of Heinricy should have only been able to run equal with a Corvette with no rewards weight. But he and the Audi ran away from the field. I was only able to keep Angelelli a few car lengths back even though he had 120# of rewards weight. That was about right although if I had that same 120# weight, te Caddy would have ran away from me. So that shows that the caddy was still above the Vette. The 1% rear weight reduction is equal to taking 15 pounds of te rear and putting it on te front. So you really think that will do very much? If my team mates were not from the Sears Pt area, we would not even go to the race. I want to race, not just go to try to get a 5th place which is the top anyone will reach unless te Caddy or Audi break. I think that they have made an error. One that might impact the credibility of the series forever, unless they reverse this decision. As a side note, they are essentially giving the GTO a 50hp boost because they did not do their homework. They have the same engine, weight and tire as us but they are not making the same hp, but not because it is not there, but because they didn't do their homework. What a bad decision. The net result is that Caddys will win every race that they want, regardless of their rewards weight. LG Yep.... Sorry Lou....that just PLAIN SUCKS! I can't believe SCCA did this! I agree that this will make it a Caddy parade! I didn't believe in Caddy sandbagging, and I CERTAINLY didn't believe in the conspiracy crap...but.....MAYBE I was wrong on the conspiracy part... I, like you, can find no logic (other than letting Caddy dominate) that would justify these changes.... Again...sorry (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) |
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Jul 4 2004, 02:55 AM
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#84
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Insert catch phrase here Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,098 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Michigan Member No.: 20 |
Right now I find it much easier to believe the SCCA is just stupid than there's a conspiracy to let Caddy win. There were plenty of stupid decisions in the Trans Am series, so why should this be any different?
I'm sorry too Lou. Like I said, I find it much easier to just race for fun, than for a career. I don't know how you put up with it. Can anyone think of a logical reason to put 20% restrictors on every car out there other than the Caddy and Audis? Is the SCCA looking to slow all the cars down for safety reasons or something? I will say one thing though. Given this new restrictor rule, the SCCA will obviously have to hit the Caddys hard when they finish 1-3 at the next race. I just don't know why they don't do it now. Still don't believe in either Caddy sandbagging or a conspiracy theory though. |
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Jul 4 2004, 04:20 AM
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#85
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
Trans AM decisions? Gentilozzi ... nuff said ... they also hitched their wagon to the HIGHLY political CHAMP car series ...
Let's "what if" for a few minutes ... What if the Caddys DON'T run 1-2-3? What if the GTO has a top 5? What if the Audi's finish OUTSIDE of the top 10? Remember, the prize is the Manufacturer's Championship as far as Caddy is concerned. An individual driver's feat is second priority ... |
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Jul 4 2004, 04:47 AM
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#86
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (mitchntx @ Jul 3 2004, 10:20 PM) Trans AM decisions? Gentilozzi ... nuff said ... they also hitched their wagon to the HIGHLY political CHAMP car series ... Let's "what if" for a few minutes ... What if the Caddys DON'T run 1-2-3? What if the GTO has a top 5? What if the Audi's finish OUTSIDE of the top 10? Remember, the prize is the Manufacturer's Championship as far as Caddy is concerned. An individual driver's feat is second priority ... I would say that if those three "what if's" happened.....the SCCA would look pretty damn good.....and would have mission accomplished.... We ALL KNOW however......those three WON'T happen with the new rules.... Mike, I was with ya on both points....just find it hard to think SCCA is THAT stupid....ESPECIALLY since all the crap they took after Sebring....and by shutting down the message board BEFORE the announcement....THEY KNEW WHAT THE REACTION WAS GOING TO BE.... WTF?? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) |
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Jul 4 2004, 04:52 AM
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#87
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Insert catch phrase here Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,098 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Michigan Member No.: 20 |
I do not believe the penalties the SCCA gave to the Audis are sufficient to make them finish out of the Top 10. I bet they are still potential race winners right behind the Caddys.
For now I see no competition for the Caddys, which is why I am absolutely confident the SCCA will come down hard on them either by Infineon or just after. What I don't understand is why they would put a 20% restrictor on every other car out there. There is something else going on that we don't know about, but I'm still saying it's not a conspiracy. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) The most logical thing to do would be to remove this new rule for 20% restrictors on everyone else, keep the new restrictions on the Audis, and make the Caddys run a car that at least looks like the street car. I do believe that was an absolutely asinine call by the SCCA in the beginning to let the Caddys run like this. However, now that Caddy has sunk this money into the series, they've sponsored the series for this year, etc. I bet there is huge pressure on the SCCA to figure out how to keep the current base car legal and make the other cars competitive. That's where they just can't get it right. They were on the right track after Sebring, but it's obvious without some weight the Caddy will still run away. |
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Jul 4 2004, 05:03 AM
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#88
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
QUOTE (94bird @ Jul 3 2004, 10:52 PM) I do not believe the penalties the SCCA gave to the Audis are sufficient to make them finish out of the Top 10. I bet they are still potential race winners right behind the Caddys. For now I see no competition for the Caddys, which is why I am absolutely confident the SCCA will come down hard on them either by Infineon or just after. What I don't understand is why they would put a 20% restrictor on every other car out there. There is something else going on that we don't know about, but I'm still saying it's not a conspiracy. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) The most logical thing to do would be to remove this new rule for 20% restrictors on everyone else, keep the new restrictions on the Audis, and make the Caddys run a car that at least looks like the street car. I do believe that was an absolutely asinine call by the SCCA in the beginning to let the Caddys run like this. However, now that Caddy has sunk this money into the series, they've sponsored the series for this year, etc. I bet there is huge pressure on the SCCA to figure out how to keep the current base car legal and make the other cars competitive. That's where they just can't get it right. They were on the right track after Sebring, but it's obvious without some weight the Caddy will still run away. Mike....agree with where you are coming from..... However.....ALL THE OTHER CARS.....for the most part were ALREADY pretty much dialed in as far as being competitive with one another...at least within a SMALL adjustment or two..... IT WAS THE CADDY'S AND AUDI'S WHO WERE OUT OF SYNC..... So why not bring those guys back to where the "field" was???? Up until now....that is what I thought SCCA was doing.....but this..... ....naw....this is something else... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) |
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Jul 4 2004, 05:10 AM
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#89
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Insert catch phrase here Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,098 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Michigan Member No.: 20 |
Yep, this is something else, like I said above. Don't understand the 20% thing. Don't understand the WC board going down either. I'd love to see what's being said in the racer's part of the forum that we can't get into.
Hey Lou . . . (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Mitch, I'm a little worried that you work for a nuclear power plant and are very anxious to believe in conspiracies. Any chance you've picked up this tendency since being involved with government agencies? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) See, since I'm in the automotive industry I might see the logic in believing that the people who are high up at the UAW secretly own a huge amount of property in Mexico and China and are driving business out of the US as part of their master plan to sell their foreign property, make a huge killing, and retire to a small Carribean island. |
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Jul 4 2004, 01:12 PM
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#90
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
QUOTE (94bird @ Jul 3 2004, 11:10 PM) Mitch, I'm a little worried that you work for a nuclear power plant and are very anxious to believe in conspiracies. Any chance you've picked up this tendency since being involved with government agencies? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) Maybe so ... good point. I see so many changes come from "governing bodys" that make absolutely no sense and are knee jerk reactions to a small group of lobbyists' constant whining, that, to me at least, this is just sooooooo obvious ... And we all know that the SCCA is not known for it's user friendly attitude. |
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Jul 5 2004, 05:14 PM
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#91
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Senior Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 5,226 Joined: 24-December 03 From: Danville, CA, USA Member No.: 27 |
hmmmm, Speed board is back up....funny....when it went down, I had a browser open to it open all day, and when I go home I posted a question to the SCCA as to why the rule changes and the clandestine tactics of shutting down the board, and when we could expect an explaination....
...it posted fine, I was able to read it after it was done... it is gone now... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) |
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Jul 5 2004, 09:01 PM
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#92
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Nothing says 'I love you.' like a box of Hydroshoks Group: Moderators Posts: 5,284 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Granbury, TX Member No.: 4 |
LOL ...
It appears I'm not the only one who thinks that a conspiracy is in place ... http://www.99chevy.com/forum/read_thread.c...dID=37&Thread=7 |
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Jul 6 2004, 03:12 AM
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#93
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Insert catch phrase here Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,098 Joined: 23-December 03 From: Michigan Member No.: 20 |
I think the ls1.com mods have taken over the SCCA Pro Racing board.
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Jul 9 2004, 04:32 PM
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#94
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Scaring slow F body drivers with a VW diesel Group: Member Posts: 449 Joined: 23-June 04 From: Mt Gilead, Ohio Member No.: 376 |
Well, this should be an interesting addition to the mix: Porsche Challenge team
Wonder how they will do? |
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