[tjZ28]

****************************************************

So that brings me back to my actual question: can a LT1 Fbody be Nationally Competitive in ESP?

Let’s face it even with every ESP legal motor mod a LT1 is only going to do maybe 275RWHP. LS1 cars are doing 290-320 RWHP STOCK and with the full array of ESP legal motor mods can put down probably 350RWHP. I’ve heard of a few ESP cars that claim 400RWHP ESP legal, but frankly I don’t buy that (I’ve been around the LS1 community a long time and outside of this particular car/driver’s claim I’ve never seen a bolt-on LS1 make those kind of numbers).

On top of that a LT1 car is probably an extra 100lbs nose-heavy.

So, what do you all think: Can a LT1 still be Nationally Competitive in ESP, obviously excluding the driver issue? (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

-TJ

This post has been edited by tjZ28: Apr 21 2008, 08:36 PM

[tjZ28]

Thanks for the advice! I'm leaning more and more towards building this car, so now I'm starting to look into the budget it'd take to get it competitive. Here's what I'm working with...

• '97 Z28
• Six Speed
• Hardtop
• Crank Windows Etc
• ~100k Miles
• A lot of fresh parts (clutch, u-joints, water pump, this and that sensor, oil pan gasket, intake gasket, etc)
• 18x11 & 18x12 CCW Classics (from Z06) w/ 315/30-18 & 335/30-18 A6s

So I'm thinking I need at least the follwoing to get in the ballpark of competitive:

• Good Diff (what's working these days? T2R, ???)
• Ground Control Setup in the Front (probably somewhere around 800-900#)
• "Weight Jacker" Setup in the Rear (probably around 300#)
• Shocks (I'm up in the air here, pretty much nothing off the shelf would work well w/ the spring rates I have in mind, maybe just have Strano valve some Bilsteins for me?)
• Sways: Strano Bars
• Brakes: LS1 Front Upgrade w/ HP+, SS Lines, Fresh Stock stuff in the Rear, Adj. Proportioning Valve
• APHR: Build my own AL/Heim
• Lower/Level APHR

To get the car to the top level of competition (even though I probably won't be there as a driver yet):

• Motor Work: The motor is healhty, but I'd need a CAI (actually might have one from another car), LTs + True Duals, Under-Drive Pullies, Roller Rockers, and a good Tune to get competative. If/when the motor dies a full LT4 build would be the way to go.
• '93 Trans
• UETA
• ????

-TJ

[Racer X]

Most (but not all) 4th gen ESP cars run a T2R (there are a few other not-as-good options).

Most (but not all) 4th gen ESP cars usually run a 500 - 600 lb spring in the front and 150s in the rear, But if you're going to mess with the PHR, then yeah, I guess you'll have to run it stiffer. FWIW since we're talking about being nationally competitive here, I'd hate to experience what a "stiff" car would feel like at HPT. I ran there on a warm day in May and my "soft" car never felt like it got hold of the surface. I'd think that the stiffer cars would really skate around there on a cold day in late September. *shrug*

I have absolutely no problems with wheelhop under braking with a comparable setup to your list. The adjustable prop valve would be an unnecessary waste of time IMHO.

Roller rockers are not legal for an LT1 in ESP trim.

An LT4 build would have to *exactly* reproduce an LT4 right down to the smallest detail.

[tjZ28]

Most (but not all) 4th gen ESP cars run a T2R (there are a few other not-as-good options).

Most (but not all) 4th gen ESP cars usually run a 500 - 600 lb spring in the front and 150s in the rear, But if you're going to mess with the PHR, then yeah, I guess you'll have to run it stiffer. FWIW since we're talking about being nationally competitive here, I'd hate to experience what a "stiff" car would feel like at HPT. I ran there on a warm day in May and my "soft" car never felt like it got hold of the surface. I'd think that the stiffer cars would really skate around there on a cold day in late September. *shrug*

I have absolutely no problems with wheelhop under braking with a comparable setup to your list. The adjustable prop valve would be an unnecessary waste of time IMHO.

Roller rockers are not legal for an LT1 in ESP trim.

An LT4 build would have to *exactly* reproduce an LT4 right down to the smallest detail.

Hmm, I guess I hadn't considered the surface @ HPT. I'm spoiled with Castle Airforce Base out here. I'm still a long way off from specin' my spring rates, but it doesn't hurt to start researching now. I had 500 or 550s (don't remember off the top of my head) in my '99 Z/28 and they were certainly too soft for the surfaces out here.

As for the Rockers thanks for the heads up. It looks like I need to read the rule book again.

What all is involved in "exactly" reproducing a LT4? I have access to a true LT4 block/heads/intake if the internals are only modded to the ESP rules would that be enough?

-TJ

[Mojave]

Most (but not all) 4th gen ESP cars run a T2R (there are a few other not-as-good options).

Most (but not all) 4th gen ESP cars usually run a 500 - 600 lb spring in the front and 150s in the rear, But if you're going to mess with the PHR, then yeah, I guess you'll have to run it stiffer. FWIW since we're talking about being nationally competitive here, I'd hate to experience what a "stiff" car would feel like at HPT. I ran there on a warm day in May and my "soft" car never felt like it got hold of the surface. I'd think that the stiffer cars would really skate around there on a cold day in late September. *shrug*

I have absolutely no problems with wheelhop under braking with a comparable setup to your list. The adjustable prop valve would be an unnecessary waste of time IMHO.

Roller rockers are not legal for an LT1 in ESP trim.

An LT4 build would have to *exactly* reproduce an LT4 right down to the smallest detail.

Hmm, I guess I hadn't considered the surface @ HPT. I'm spoiled with Castle Airforce Base out here. I'm still a long way off from specin' my spring rates, but it doesn't hurt to start researching now. I had 500 or 550s (don't remember off the top of my head) in my '99 Z/28 and they were certainly too soft for the surfaces out here.

As for the Rockers thanks for the heads up. It looks like I need to read the rule book again.

What all is involved in "exactly" reproducing a LT4? I have access to a true LT4 block/heads/intake if the internals are only modded to the ESP rules would that be enough?

-TJ

You would need a complete, factory LT4. There are a lot of little details about the LT4 that are over-looked.

http://www.grandsportregistry.com/lt1vslt4.htm


Also, do anyone know if the f-body LT4's were 2 bolt or 4 bolt mains?

[BigEnos]

Also, do anyone know if the f-body LT4's were 2 bolt or 4 bolt mains?

I've asked around and the consensus from those who've torn them apart is that they are 4-bolt, identical to the 'vette motors internally.

I've gotten as far as an estimate for the cost of building one (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) , then I got skrrrd. Engine builder swears he can get crank HP numbers that start with a "4" though (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)