Life is short, F*** it... need your input Options

[Mojave]

I don't know about all that warrenty stuff. Would have to search that on your own. But the latest Car & Driver had the GTR kick the pants off of the Viper, ZO6 and GT3RS. Everything I've read says the GTR likes to be abused and tossed around on track. And noone has writen a bad report on one yet. I also got to see one in person here in Va Beach at a baseball game. In person the car is absolutely beatiful. It has body lines that pictures just can't capture and it has a VERY aggresive nose. If they came in a true manual I would think it would be a no brainer (well for me anyway)

The GTR magazine tests are all very fishy. Example:

Automobile: 11.6@ 126
Car and Driver 12.6@111

Where in the world did Automobile find 1 sec and 15 mph trap speed on an automatic, AWD car with launch control!?!?! 15 mph difference in trap speed on car that weighs 3800 lbs is around 125 hp difference. Nissan already admitted they cheated on the 'ring test with slicks and more boost, so how many of the magazine cars were cheater cars? If you look at some of the track results at Buttonwillow, the GTR had the fastest times in the slowest portion of the track. No AWD Playstation magic can change the fact that the GTR is heavy heavy heavy. The Z06 tires were worn and beat Michelins, and the GTR comes with some very soft, very special Bridgestones that appear to be different from the regular tires of the same model. Something is up.

Not to hate on the GTR, but everything is very, very, very, very fishy. I can't wait to see some ET's and trap speeds for actual customer cars. My guess is they will be mid to high 12's at under 114 mph, and when you compare a Z06 on R's to a GTR on R's, the Z06 is going to come out on top.




To keep my post on topic, I say Z06 all the way. The Mustang is porky, and a cammed LS7 will make more power than most will ever need on a RR car. Fix the front brakes, get some weight out of it, and go really, really fast.

This post has been edited by Mojave: Aug 29 2008, 12:25 AM

[CMC #37]

I've been in a lot of new Z06s as an instructor at Thunderhill. What a great track car! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/2thumbs.gif)

[Bram]

c6 z06 and keep the ss

[Rob Hood]

Crossed flags for me...any day of the week.

[00 Trans Ram]

You're right, Eugenio - it's cheaper and easier to buy a race car already built. I built my own, and it's the last time I'll do that. If/When I ever look for another one, I'll look to find something that was fast, but not podium (drives up price). Also, something that's had between 2 and 5 races on it since any major work (engine, tranny, etc). That way it's still fresh, but proven.

BTW, I drive a G8GT as a daily driver.

That's very interesting about the GTR on slicks - I was really wondering how a 3800lbs, 4-door car with similar power was running the 'Ring at faster times than a Z06.

[Crazy Canuck]

Good God, man. Why?

I assume you've ridden/driven a new Z06 ... they are a BEAST in stock trim.

Yes I have... I find it to have decent power.

So, you are a male prostitute or a pimp?

None of the above...

driving and racing motorcycles, one gets used to power and accelerations.
My SS has pretty much the same power as the C6-Z06, although the Z06 is lighter and better.
I've driven many cars, including some supercars.
This last weekend, I actually saw a GT-R in Ottawa... sweet car, actually.

[Crazy Canuck]

c6 z06 and keep the ss

the SS ain't going nowhere... that's a no-brainer.

[mitchntx]

You're right, Eugenio - it's cheaper and easier to buy a race car already built. I built my own, and it's the last time I'll do that. If/When I ever look for another one, I'll look to find something that was fast, but not podium (drives up price). Also, something that's had between 2 and 5 races on it since any major work (engine, tranny, etc). That way it's still fresh, but proven.

And I've found just the opposite.

It's a lot cheaper to build it than to rebuild it. Buying a used race car is buying someone else's "engineering". We've worked on a few of those "fresh and sorted" cars and they were absolute POS. The standing around scratching your head trying to figure out what the builder was thinking and when a gremlin arises, tracking down the issue in an unfamiliar build are just 2 examples of what I'm talking about.

Granted, it gets you on the track faster but you'll spend 1/2 -2/3 the purchase price making it faster on the track.

my experience.

[Crazy Canuck]

So Mitch, what you look for when looking for a racecar ?
I'm thinking a good frame, as long as the car is running.

The interior will be gutted anyways, a rollcage will be installed, racing buckets will be installed, most electronics removed.
Please enlighten.

[BigEnos]

I don't know about all that warrenty stuff. Would have to search that on your own. But the latest Car & Driver had the GTR kick the pants off of the Viper, ZO6 and GT3RS. Everything I've read says the GTR likes to be abused and tossed around on track. And noone has writen a bad report on one yet. I also got to see one in person here in Va Beach at a baseball game. In person the car is absolutely beatiful. It has body lines that pictures just can't capture and it has a VERY aggresive nose. If they came in a true manual I would think it would be a no brainer (well for me anyway)

The GTR magazine tests are all very fishy. Example:

Automobile: 11.6@ 126
Car and Driver 12.6@111

Where in the world did Automobile find 1 sec and 15 mph trap speed on an automatic, AWD car with launch control!?!?! 15 mph difference in trap speed on car that weighs 3800 lbs is around 125 hp difference. Nissan already admitted they cheated on the 'ring test with slicks and more boost, so how many of the magazine cars were cheater cars? If you look at some of the track results at Buttonwillow, the GTR had the fastest times in the slowest portion of the track. No AWD Playstation magic can change the fact that the GTR is heavy heavy heavy. The Z06 tires were worn and beat Michelins, and the GTR comes with some very soft, very special Bridgestones that appear to be different from the regular tires of the same model. Something is up.

Not to hate on the GTR, but everything is very, very, very, very fishy. I can't wait to see some ET's and trap speeds for actual customer cars. My guess is they will be mid to high 12's at under 114 mph, and when you compare a Z06 on R's to a GTR on R's, the Z06 is going to come out on top.




To keep my post on topic, I say Z06 all the way. The Mustang is porky, and a cammed LS7 will make more power than most will ever need on a RR car. Fix the front brakes, get some weight out of it, and go really, really fast.

This doesn't surprise me a bit. When the last gen Supras came out and they were getting insane times that just didn't seem to correlate to the power/weight ratio everyone was like (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) But, a couple years later when the mag's went back to test "normal" cars they just couldn't replicate the numbers. A guy from TRD admitted that they had "upgraded" the press-fleet cars at the debut to get the hype up. This is business-as-usual for japanese automakers. Some of their achievements are smoke and mirrors.

That being said, the GT-R is still a cool car IMHO. And look at the Supra resale numbers now, GT-R might be similar.

[00 Trans Ram]

You're right, Eugenio - it's cheaper and easier to buy a race car already built. I built my own, and it's the last time I'll do that. If/When I ever look for another one, I'll look to find something that was fast, but not podium (drives up price). Also, something that's had between 2 and 5 races on it since any major work (engine, tranny, etc). That way it's still fresh, but proven.

And I've found just the opposite.

It's a lot cheaper to build it than to rebuild it. Buying a used race car is buying someone else's "engineering". We've worked on a few of those "fresh and sorted" cars and they were absolute POS. The standing around scratching your head trying to figure out what the builder was thinking and when a gremlin arises, tracking down the issue in an unfamiliar build are just 2 examples of what I'm talking about.

Granted, it gets you on the track faster but you'll spend 1/2 -2/3 the purchase price making it faster on the track.

my experience.

I'll trust your experience. You've got more than me!

Another option that would probably take care of those concerns is to rent a racecar when you go to the track. For about $500-800 per day, you can get a good car to have fun with. It may sound like a lot, but just getting into a car you'll be happy with (no Spec Miata, I'm assuming) will cost you $30k. At $750 per day, that's 40 race days. Assuming 1 per month, that'll get you racing for over 3 years. But you're in Canada, so it could last longer.

The nice thing about renting is that you don't have to worry about a thing. Arrive and drive. No hauling, no changing tires, no upkeep, no storage for the winter. Yeah, you have to drive someone else's car, but they can usually help you set it up pretty quickly. And after a few races, they'll have the car setup like you like it before it gets to the track.

[Torque]

Another vote for the Z06 option but very curious about the comments on the front brakes. What's the issue with the brakes? Is it simply a pad upgrade? Larger rotors, etc?

I recently went through a similar decision process this past year (Z06 vs. Mod C6 vs. Full blown race build on my Camaro which was previously street/strip car) and went with building a race car. I already have a tow vehicle (daily driver) and once I recover from the cost of the build... may look at a fun street car like the new GT8 that should be coming out in a manual, used value GTS-V, etc. Maybe Vette but the wife is horrified that they come with a lifetime supply of wife-beaters and gold chains and that we'll move to Jersey. Still working on the whole image thing with her.

Anyway, despite it taking much longer than I ever would have imagined, I'm still happy with the decision as you get to make things the way you want them from day one. Obviously a large price to pay vs. buying used but I'll be much more comfortable knowing the car's safe and should be more reliable when I hit the track.

The Nissan is way too Fast and Furious for me. If you are into Fast and Furious, seems decent but be prepared for having a very limited production car that will pretty much be dealer serviced only. I'd be shocked if the average Nissan service department that's used to working on cars 1/4 the cost would have a clue about what to do with the thing when you show up for service (besides taking it out and beating on it). Your other options allow you to wrench on it yourself and/or have decent options for experienced service etc.

[Mojave]

Another vote for the Z06 option but very curious about the comments on the front brakes. What's the issue with the brakes? Is it simply a pad upgrade? Larger rotors, etc?

Z06's use 6 individual padlets per caliper (1 per piston). On track, the padlets wear very, very fast, and usually unevenly. A fast, hard braking HPDE driver can burn up a set of padlets in 1 day. Carbotech (and probably others) make replacement padlets in good compounds, but be prepared to pay over $300 (sometimes $350) a set for them, and even the good padlets only last a weekend.

The rotors are beefy 14" units and the calipers work well, but the padlets plain suck.

[00 Trans Ram]

I wonder if people replace the calipers? At $300 per track day, a set of $1500 MovIt calipers will pay for itself real quick!

[Torque]

ok, that makes sense. It's a shame that it works out that way but if that's the one and only thing you need to worry about.... really can't complain!

[Spruill242]

Why not save some money and buy a C5 ZO6?? Use the extra money to buy what you need to make it as fast as you want it. Just playing devils advocate. Buy a Radical... I've seen those things go REALLY fast.

I think you need to look at the power/weight ratio per dollar spent factor. There has to be stuff out there with the same performance as a C6 ZO6 for less.

This post has been edited by Spruill242: Aug 29 2008, 08:49 PM

[Crazy Canuck]

this one looks good:
http://www.canadatrader.com/result/detaili...gno=1&srt=1

[SSTAT]

GTR's suck. I passed one on track like it was tied to a stump 3 weeks ago at mid-ohio in my 420hp camaro...

Yes, I have some mad driving skills...

OK the driver sucked, but it was triumphant nonetheless.

Did I ever tell you guys about the time I passed a Carrera GT on track? - Yea alright that driver sucked too.

PS: ZO6

This post has been edited by SSTAT: Sep 12 2008, 01:42 AM

[Rob Hood]

Right now there is a BLACK C6 Z06 at a dealer here in Chandler with no additional markup sticker.

[Crazy Canuck]

markup is illegal in Canada, actually... so no dealer can sell over MSRP... they can have waiting lists, but cannot sell for more.