Speed World Challenge ... Options

[LG Motorsports]

Ok,
Here is the deal.

Audi= faster than Caddy at present levels.

Caddy faster then everything else at base weight, where Heinricy was

Porsche, Viper, Corvette very close, except that the Porsche and Viper are a little light.

BMW needs Auberlen or Boris to be as fast as last year

Mustang= big power medium driving, but hard to tell if it could be faster. Boris will be in one at Sears point then we will see.

Rewards weight skews the curve. The 2 regular Caddys and Audi had over 100 pounds in rewards weight which should caculate to a 1.2 second slower car at Mid O. when in reality the Audi was faster than the unweighted Caddy. So the Audi should come down to the Caddy speed. But were it not for the Audi, the Caddy would have run away with the show, so it needs to come back to the performance levels of the other cars.

Forget about where and why they finished 6th and 7th, just keep in mind that the unweighted caddy was just as dominant as the Audi that had 100 pounds of rewards weight. And the Viper only had 60 pounds and the Vettes had NO Weight.

An unweighted Vette could not keep up with the unweighted Caddy, period.


The answer is that SCCA has a hard job dealing with the factorys. the real answer is that they should beat the factorys down to the point that only a non factory car can win for 3 races to make up for the Audi/Caddy gifts that they were given at Sebring, LR and Mid O.


LG

[Mericet]

Well, we can only hope the SCCA can somehow keep the playing field level. I, for one, would like to see the private teams beating the factory teams.

[CMC #37]

Here here Mericet! Go private guys!

[rmackintosh]

Ok,
Here is the deal.

Audi= faster than Caddy at present levels.

Caddy faster then everything else at base weight, where Heinricy was

Porsche, Viper, Corvette very close, except that the Porsche and Viper are a little light.

BMW needs Auberlen or Boris to be as fast as last year

Mustang= big power medium driving, but hard to tell if it could be faster. Boris will be in one at Sears point then we will see.

Rewards weight skews the curve. The 2 regular Caddys and Audi had over 100 pounds in rewards weight which should caculate to a 1.2 second slower car at Mid O. when in reality the Audi was faster than the unweighted Caddy. So the Audi should come down to the Caddy speed. But were it not for the Audi, the Caddy would have run away with the show, so it needs to come back to the performance levels of the other cars.

Forget about where and why they finished 6th and 7th, just keep in mind that the unweighted caddy was just as dominant as the Audi that had 100 pounds of rewards weight. And the Viper only had 60 pounds and the Vettes had NO Weight.

An unweighted Vette could not keep up with the unweighted Caddy, period.


The answer is that SCCA has a hard job dealing with the factorys. the real answer is that they should beat the factorys down to the point that only a non factory car can win for 3 races to make up for the Audi/Caddy gifts that they were given at Sebring, LR and Mid O.


LG

OK....now you're talkin' Lou.....I can agree with that! ESPECIALLY the part where you mention WEIGHTED Audi's being FASTER than UNWEIGHTED Caddys (i.e. Hienracy). Now THAT is just plain wrong for that to be happening! The Audi rewards weight should have kicked in by now....

In short.....Audi should be moved back in some way (boost???) other than weight and rewards weight, as they will WHINE LIKE DOGS that their tires will fall off the car with more weight (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) . I can agree that an unweighted Caddy (again Heinracy) was too fast for the field.....NOT MIND BOGGLING fast like Sebring, but another slight adjustment may be needed to the "base" car. As far as rewards weight affecting the Caddy's, I think it HAS, and if the base was TWEAKED a little....not hammered like last time....the Caddy would be good to go....

Ultra short version:

Audi: Fairly major adjustment ON TOP of rewards weight needed.
Caddy: Fairly minor adjustment needed to base car.

Look forward to seeing you in person back at the front at Sears Lou!

(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

[PF Flyer]

... 'I love the smell of race gas in the morning'. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

[trackbird]

... 'I love the smell of race gas in the morning'. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

[mitchntx]

octane good ...

[Barney]

Okay Admit great drivers equal great results.

Audi-Pobst great drivers, lots o' cash (via factory) = podium finishes
Caddy-Hienrocket, Pilgrim, Max A, lots o' cash (via factory)= podium finishes
Viper-Tommy Archer, lots of sponsor cash = podium finishes
Lou G- More talant than cash = some podium finishes
Culver- don't know much about him but fast at Mid-O
Tommy Oats- mix of talent and cash
Vipers, Vettes, Porsches mixed the rest of the field from front to back. O'h and a GTO (sorry Stu)
The Mustang has no competition hope in this race. Should be moved to WCT (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

These are my ramblings, but the point is the above mentioned names can do well in any car given seat time and Lots O' Cash. Lou+Caddy=Podium, Tommy Archer+Caddy+podium, Stu Hayner+Caddy=Podium and so on.

I can't remeber where I have heard this but: "Where Money Buys Speed" (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[mitchntx]

LOL ... I've procured a lot of speed there ....

[rmackintosh]

LOL ... I've procured a lot of speed there ....

AND.....dropped a lot of MONEY there... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

[lateapex]

I just watched “Cadillac Test Drive, CTS-V” on Speed Channel. In one segment they had Max Angelelli and Andy Pilgrim in the CTS-VR cars and Tommy Kendall in the CTS-V (street version) on the track at Sebring at the same time. Seeing the 2 models side by side from a distance, you would NOT think they were the same car. One looks tall and narrow, while the other looks very wide and low.

As they get closer, you can see that they both have the same “fart and science” styling theme that defines Cadillac today. Pratt and Miller really did a good job of retaining the “look” of the regular V. The VR has all of the jarring asymmetrical origami creases of the street car, similar greenhouse, even appears to have real headlights (or VERY good decals). NASCAR should do so well.

But, the silhouettes are just 2 different vehicles. Does anyone know if the WC Vipers and Vettes are chopped and widened any?

[mitchntx]

I heard that there were some significant rules changes for everyone ... except the GTO (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

I just went to www.sccapro.com and clicked on the "Discussion Forums"

Anything look funny to anyone?

(IMG:http://24.0.108.222/mitchntx/SCCAProBd.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

[rmackintosh]

I heard that there were some significant rules changes for everyone ... except the GTO (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

I just went to www.sccapro.com and clicked on the "Discussion Forums"

Anything look funny to anyone?

(IMG:http://24.0.108.222/mitchntx/SCCAProBd.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

WOW!!!!!

That is UN...F'ING...BELIEVABLE....!!!

They hit the Audi....YEAH!


But say Caddy is good, and ALL THE OTHERS GET 20% less air???????????????? WTF????

....then disable the message board...........

that is REALLY hoaky man....

Sorry Lou!

(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

[mitchntx]

I guess the SCCA web admin staff are out driving their new "evaluation" CTSs as we type ...

[mitchntx]

I clicked on "Contact" at the bottom and sent Eric this

What happened that stripped the WC forum?

The other forums seem to work OK ...

Signed
A fan, quickly becoming disillusioned with all the politics ...

[rmackintosh]

I clicked on "Contact" at the bottom and sent Eric this

What happened that stripped the WC forum?

The other forums seem to work OK ...

Signed
A fan, quickly becoming disillusioned with all the politics ...

...damn....all this time I have been defending SCCA and the goings on against the two "unreasonable" Caddy complaints:

1. Caddy Sandbagging
2. Caddy conspiracy to "own" the series

IN MY WILDEST IMAGINATION, I WOULD NEVER HAVE THOUGHT I WOULD BE PROVEN WRONG ON THE CONSPIRACY SIDE OF THINGS!!!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)

In the back of my mind I thought....OK....Caddy ****MIGHT**** do something to make it "LOOK" like they were sandbagging and I will have to defend my points, but this move by the SCCA STINKS OF SOME REAL OFFENSIVE "decision" making.... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

EVEN I GOT TO ADMIT......THIS JUST HANDS CADDY THE UPPER HAND IN SO MANY WAYS!!!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

Hell....maybe I better complain since Caddy is OBVIOUSLY handing SCCA so much money my GODDAMN ENTRY FEES should go down eh?????

(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

SICK man.....JUST SICK!

[94bird]

For those of you looking for the details on the rules updates - http://www.world-challenge.com/news/04press96.html

Yep, I'm glad I'm just an amateur wannabe racer. If I had a large budget sunk into a team changes like this would throw me and my budget for a loop I'm sure. I have no idea why they would hit everyone with handicaps instead of just trying to even out the playing field by going after the ones that are dominating the series.

[94bird]

IN MY WILDEST IMAGINATION, I WOULD NEVER HAVE THOUGHT I WOULD BE PROVEN WRONG ON THE CONSPIRACY SIDE OF THINGS!!!! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)

I hightly doubt there's a conspiracy to have Caddy dominate the series. SCCA made a mistake letting Caddy into the WC with their huge changes from the street car and they realized it. They have rendered the Caddy uncompetitive until this change, and the jury's still out on the end effect of this change. Notice, they hit the Audi on many fronts - rpm limit, weight, and turbo boost. Only Heinricy's Caddy did well at Mid Ohio. With these changes I'm sure it would have dominated that race, but then it would instantly get hit with weight, just like the other Caddys that are now mid pack runners.

[rmackintosh]

IN MY WILDEST IMAGINATION, I WOULD NEVER HAVE THOUGHT I WOULD BE PROVEN WRONG ON THE CONSPIRACY SIDE OF THINGS!!!!    (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)   (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)   (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)   (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)

I hightly doubt there's a conspiracy to have Caddy dominate the series. SCCA made a mistake letting Caddy into the WC with their huge changes from the street car and they realized it. They have rendered the Caddy uncompetitive until this change, and the jury's still out on the end effect of this change. Notice, they hit the Audi on many fronts - rpm limit, weight, and turbo boost. Only Heinricy's Caddy did well at Mid Ohio. With these changes I'm sure it would have dominated that race, but then it would instantly get hit with weight, just like the other Caddys that are now mid pack runners.

Mike,

Your points ARE EXACTLY MY POINTS.....from ****yesterday**** (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

But the Caddy Base was STILL able to catch the Audis at the end of the last race.....some would say that without the crazy long yellow, and shortened race....the Audi's tires were DONE, and Caddy would have WALKED AWAY WITH IT.....

WHERE DOES THAT LEAVE THE SERIES.....penalize EVERYBODY BUT CADDY?????

uh un.....NO WAY!

(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

[94bird]

Like I said. Only Heinricy's "base" Caddy was competitive in that race. As soon as he wins a race he won't be "base" anymore. He'll be just like the other mid-pack running Caddys. Keep in mind that was Heinricy driving too. Pairing his experience with these cars and Mid Ohio makes him Caddy's attempt to show SCCA the Audis were unbeatable even if Caddy threw everything they had at them. It appears to have worked.