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> Time Trials for NFME 2008!
NFME 2008 Time trials!
How much are you willing to pay extra to participate
Nothing [ 1 ] ** [7.14%]
Anything up to $50.00 [ 4 ] ** [28.57%]
$50 to $100 [ 7 ] ** [50.00%]
I don't care how much, where do I sign up? [ 2 ] ** [14.29%]
Total Votes: 14
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TrakCar
post Aug 27 2007, 02:24 PM
Post #1


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During our investigation it appears that there will be a increased cost associated with running a time trial at next years NFME (insurance increase). For that reason we decided to setup a poll to get a feeling if as a group we would be willing to pay a small premium to add this event.

Andris and I are in the beginning stages of hammering out the details so nothing is currently set in stone.
Here a couple hightlights:

1) We will probably "Borrow" NASA's current TT classifications and adapt them for our cars and typical modifications. It is likely for simplicity sake we will break down groups similar to the Auto-X classes (stock, street prepared, prepared, and Holy Crap (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) )

2) All drivers wishing to participate will need to have a minimum amount of experience, and be signed off by our groups instructors.

3) We are looking at several options for timing ans scoring, details to be
announced later.

4) You will need to be signed up for the regular road course event, this is a add on event (well Duuuuhhhh)


Our current proposal is to charge $50 for registration to the time trial portion of the event. At this time, your not signing up for anything, but please don't tell us you'd do it if your not at least thinking hard about it.
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Shortcutsleeping
post Aug 28 2007, 02:51 AM
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Let me see if I get this.

For the 'road racing' part of the NFME the guys will take to the track in run groups similar to HPDE stuff. BUT, one of the groups will be a 'time trial' group and it will be an actual competition (as opposed to an hpde 'driver education event' theme) for the lowest lap time for the four subgroups in the 'TT' group.

Is that right?

Will we need transponders (I have one, but many might not) or will people be timing? (I know you mentioned this, I'm bringing it up as if you have to rent a bunch of them from the local scca/nasa region it might incur more costs than ya'll had planned).

How have the 'RR' portion of the NFME been handled in the past? Was it all-out-there-at-once? Or was it broken into rungroups and each group got XX minutes during the rotation?

Thanks for the info and all the effort,

Costas
cars and such...
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z28tt
post Aug 28 2007, 05:25 AM
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Costas,
The TT is a competition near the end of the 2nd day, once everyone is familiar with the track. In the past we've done four 20-30 minute run groups - one and two for the inexperienced folks, three for the intermediates, and four for the instructors & advanced drivers. Since the cars are for the most part evenly matched (no 100 hp ITA cars vs 700 hp GT1 cars), it's a bit easier to group by experience, and move folks around as needed, and give instructors some time off. If everything goes smoothly with the students, I'd love to do open sessions (no run groups), at least for the 2nd day - everyone gets all the track time they can handle, without being constrained to a schedule, which is very helpful for test and tune, instead of fixed time slots and schedules that slip. When instructing, I'm a huge proponent of always checking your mirrors and letting the guy behind you pass as soon as possible (he got there by driving faster, duh! You'd be surprised how many folks - usually in expensive p or f-cars at some other club events don't get this). We're still working on the timing details, which depends if enough people are interested.

Andris

This post has been edited by z28tt: Aug 28 2007, 05:29 AM
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cccbock
post Aug 28 2007, 02:37 PM
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QUOTE (z28tt @ Aug 28 2007, 12:25 AM) *
Costas,
The TT is a competition near the end of the 2nd day, once everyone is familiar with the track. In the past we've done four 20-30 minute run groups - one and two for the inexperienced folks, three for the intermediates, and four for the instructors & advanced drivers. Since the cars are for the most part evenly matched (no 100 hp ITA cars vs 700 hp GT1 cars), it's a bit easier to group by experience, and move folks around as needed, and give instructors some time off. If everything goes smoothly with the students, I'd love to do open sessions (no run groups), at least for the 2nd day - everyone gets all the track time they can handle, without being constrained to a schedule, which is very helpful for test and tune, instead of fixed time slots and schedules that slip. When instructing, I'm a huge proponent of always checking your mirrors and letting the guy behind you pass as soon as possible (he got there by driving faster, duh! You'd be surprised how many folks - usually in expensive p or f-cars at some other club events don't get this). We're still working on the timing details, which depends if enough people are interested.

Andris


Andris covers it well, but just as additional clarification...for those that may not have been to the NFME before.

Our "Road Race" event (road race is a misnomer here) began 12 years ago when there were virtually no HPDEs (formerly called Open tracking or Lapping) open to Novice drivers. NFME RR event really is an HPDE and driving school, and we encourage novices with any year F-body cars to attend and learn the limits of their own ability and their car.

Licensed Road Racers and Time Trial drivers from a recognized sanctioning body (like SCCA or NASA) or people that can demonstrate significant experience will be grouped or classed with others of similar experience, with the exception of the possible open session Andris alluded to. The open session is not a done deal, but we are heading that direction. Time Trial is a feature we are hoping to incorporate for the first time, but we cant ask the Novices and HPDE people to underwrite the additional expenses. BTW, Novices will need to be signed off by their instructor to run Time Trial due to insurance concerns.

For those so inclined, don't forget we will also have a full autocross the NFME 2008 open to all who register for it. Some of our fellow FRRAXers have won the AX event in the recent years events.

Bock
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Shortcutsleeping
post Aug 28 2007, 02:44 PM
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Thanks Andris.

That makes total sense and count me in. I instruct here in Texas and preach the same thing! The MOMENT the guy gets close, let him by and follow him. He is faster than you for a reason. Why is it that p and f boys have SO much trouble with that concept?

I like the 'all the track time you can handle' thing, that FOR SURE works! What about passengers?

Costas
cars and such...


ps: my ITA car has ~160hp, thankyouverymuch! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)
(buick 231, long tubes, 500cfm 2 barrel...heh heh)
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TrakCar
post Aug 28 2007, 03:01 PM
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QUOTE (Shortcutsleeping @ Aug 28 2007, 08:44 AM) *
Thanks Andris.

That makes total sense and count me in. I instruct here in Texas and preach the same thing! The MOMENT the guy gets close, let him by and follow him. He is faster than you for a reason. Why is it that p and f boys have SO much trouble with that concept?

I like the 'all the track time you can handle' thing, that FOR SURE works! What about passengers?

Costas
cars and such...


ps: my ITA car has ~160hp, thankyouverymuch! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)
(buick 231, long tubes, 500cfm 2 barrel...heh heh)



Once signed off for solo driving, Drivers can have passengers provided they have the same safety equipment as the driver. One of my favorite parts of the event is Taking Drag race guys out on the track and hooking them on road course stuff. I had a guy cuss me out after a session because he had just spent a load of $ converting his car from a 6 spd to a TH350, and he was mad because now he had to change back!
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axoid
post Aug 28 2007, 10:30 PM
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QUOTE (cccbock @ Aug 28 2007, 08:37 AM) *
Some of our fellow FRRAXers have won the AX event in the recent years events.


(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/gr_driving3.gif)
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TrakCar
post Aug 29 2007, 03:06 PM
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QUOTE (axoid @ Aug 28 2007, 04:30 PM) *
QUOTE (cccbock @ Aug 28 2007, 08:37 AM) *
Some of our fellow FRRAXers have won the AX event in the recent years events.


(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/gr_driving3.gif)



Bill, you only got me by .011 seconds or something crazy like that. I won last year (since you weren't there) But I'll own you this time!
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Shortcutsleeping
post Aug 29 2007, 04:57 PM
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I'm curious. How is the autocross scored? Are there just Stock, SP, P and M classes that mimmick scca and then ya'll use the corresponding pax factors to decide who wins overall?


Costas
cars and such...
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axoid
post Aug 29 2007, 10:00 PM
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QUOTE (TrakCar @ Aug 29 2007, 09:06 AM) *
Bill, you only got me by .011 seconds or something crazy like that.

A win is a win. It doesn't matter by how much. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/nutkick.gif)

QUOTE (TrakCar @ Aug 29 2007, 09:06 AM) *
But I'll own you this time!

Just keep thinking that. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Next time my car won't have a little 305.

QUOTE (Shortcutsleeping @ Aug 29 2007, 10:57 AM) *
I'm curious. How is the autocross scored? Are there just Stock, SP, P and M classes that mimmick scca and then ya'll use the corresponding pax factors to decide who wins overall?


They way they did it in 06 was two classes, "Stock" and "Street Prepared". "Stock" had my SCCA ESP car and stock GTO and everyone else was in "Street Prepared". They gave out 3 awards, one for each of the two classes and one for FTD. I took my class and FTD.
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00 Trans Ram
post Aug 31 2007, 12:26 AM
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If I'm gonna be up there, might as well do it all. I'll be glad to give people all the rides they want. I've only had 2 people ever throw up in my car.
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cccbock
post Sep 2 2007, 10:07 PM
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QUOTE (00 Trans Ram @ Aug 30 2007, 07:26 PM) *
If I'm gonna be up there, might as well do it all. I'll be glad to give people all the rides they want. I've only had 2 people ever throw up in my car.


This is posted to bring this back up in the new post log.

If you think you are going to NFME 2008, or have a good idea you may go, please vote in the poll.

If you know you are not going, then don't vote.

Thanks

Bock (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/whip.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/whip.gif) (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/whip.gif)
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