Who here is an HPDE instructor? Options

[mitchntx]

Is it just me or has there been a rash of rookie student crashes?

In the last year, I can recall 1/2 dozen or so local HPDE crashes by inexperienced drivers (not that I have a ton of experience) where significant damage has occured.

Is this a Texas trend?

[PF Flyer]

Nope, not a Texas trend. It happens everywhere.

IMO it has to do with the instructors ability to reign in the driver. Set goals that are obtainable and more important, realistic. If someone has that 'Fast 'n Furious' attitude, then a serious discussion must take place.

I'm instructing this week-end at Summit Pt. Had a couple of good students, so far. Hope the weather for Sunday hold like it was today. I don't want to have to teach the 'wet line'.

[Crazy Canuck]

sometimes you have to lay some hard ground rules, when you start seeing some yahoos... and it scares you when they are all talk and you have no clue how they gonna behave on the track.
I try to concentrate on the skills they nee to work more and make them understand that's where they need to focus.

[KeithO]

It's hard to blame instructors for every student mistake. I am a NASA instructor and I have repeatedly told students to do/not do thing and sometimes they just don't get it. In fact, my last student (not at a NASA event) was about my Mom's age (not the "Fast and Furious" type) and I worked with her and she did improve some but she still wasn't very accomplished. Late in the day, she gave someone a point-by and while watching mirrors instead of "multi-tasking", we drove straight off the track. (This was on a straightaway). There isn't much you can do in a situation like that other than be calm and give quick, clear and accurate verbal instructions... We didn't hit anything, but she tried to get back onto the track too quickly (and without looking), so what could I do...

[PF Flyer]

I certainly didn't/don't mean to imply it's all the instructors fault for what goes wrong out there. (though if he/she is pushing someone too hard and it exceeds the car/drivers ability, then bad things do happen) I always try to put a positive spin on things from the start by determining the level of experience the driver has, the level of modification the car has and setting goals of accomplishment for that one particular session. I always ask for staying 3 cars lengths behind the car in front, or I may want them staying in one particular gear around the track to better learn the line, or staying behind that slightly slower car in order to better focus on corner entry.
I look at students as either a sponge or a stone. And some stones are more pourus than others. The sponge soaks up all the input and excels throught the session and the event, while the stone shows different levels of accomplishment, some small and some better.
I've had people so set in their ways, like some of us older folks, that it is very difficult to break certain bad driving habits.
It really a good feeling, at the last session of the whole event, to sit in the right hand seat and not have to say a word and just go for a ride and enjoy the scenery with the car and driver in better control then the when you started 6 or 8 sessions ago.
I'm outta here. Headed back to Summit for the rest of this week-ends event .

[GM01SS]

I will add my $.05 worth. I am a new instructor/open track driver. I have only instructed on a couple of occasions and offer my limited experiance. I have found COMMUNICATION to be the key! Only after making sure the student knows EXACTLY what YOU want him/her to do, can it be a good experiance for both the student and instructor.

I also agree with Mike's sponge/stone theory, some "get" it while others are slower learners.

I think the biggest thing the Instructor needs to do is be in "charge".

I also have one rule......Thou shall NOT kill the instructor/or thyself! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

Gary

[JKnight]

When my wife started instructing (both me and "real" students) I bought her a Chatterbox. I wired a speaker and earpiece into her helmet, and then there is a loose earpiece / mic unit in one that the student shoves up into his/her helmet. Both plug into the communication device so that the student and instructor can talk in a normal voice instead of trying to yell. Chris doesn't instruct as much anymore, but whenever she and I split the M3 for a casual track day we take it so that she can give me pointers. I would suggest that anyone serious about instructing get a Chatterbox (I think the other type is called "Nadi" or "Naji" but I've heard that it is less reliable). It's a small investment; when you are putting your life in a student's hands the extra communication is invaluable.

Jason

[PF Flyer]

Personally, I, too, use the Chatterbox system. I installed the earpieces into my helmet with my mic mounted on the side, with the control box. Like Jason mentioned, the students earpiece/mic slips into their helmet and plugs into mine for easy communications. A great investment.

[AllZWay]

Mitch... I have been thinking that same thing.

The first couple of years I can only recall a couple of incidents of which most were in instructor run groups.. (ie...broken radiator hose being the cuprit.)

But lately I have read about several and the insurance companies having to re-write policies to exclude HPDE's.

My thought is that as OT has gained in popularity, that many more yahoo's have discoverd the track and the folks haven't gotten a real appreciation for the art of driving...just driving fast and out of control.

[CMC #37]

I think everyone who has instructed will encounter that "scary" student, hopefully not too often. The thing is, as the instructor, you are in charge of the student and it is important that is clear from the start. I think that helps calm the student down as it clarifies they can count on you for immediate feedback. Part of my spiel for new students is that if I think anything dangerous is happening I may ask them to proceed to the hot pits for a discussion, and not to take it personally, but as an opportunity to learn something valuable. At Thunderhill Street School we even went as far to have a instructor patting the roof as a cue for flaggers to black flag a car so they would for sure get the message.

After teaching the Thunderhill School for some time, I think we have been very fortunate to have a minimum of incidents. The leads of the school and the head cheese, David Vodden, have been very proactive as far as safety goes. NASA is in that same groove out here in the west, although more students are "loose" without instructors and that increases the chances of incidents due to that fact. As others have pointed out, cars running too close together seems to always be an issue. That is the easiest one to fix though! (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) It is much harder to fix someone with a 'tude!



(IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[mitchntx]

It's kind of interesting how the dynamics change from region to region.

Here in Texas, NASA HPDEs seem to cater more to the race oriented enthusast while other groups, like The Driver's Edge, are more for the enthusiast who just got his mitts on a HP car ...