I am fairly new to the road racing arena. Would practicing road-racing via realistic video gaming at home help my driving skills? Or, would it be a waste of time?

I haven't actually raced (yet), but I have maybe 30 track days under my belt. I have spent countless hours playing Gran Turismo 2 and Gran Turismo 3 on the Playstation, and Forza 2 on the Xbox 360. The Xbox has some US tracks that are portrayed very realistically. Laguna Seca and Road Atlanta come to mind. GT3 has Sears Point (Infineon) fairly realistically. Playing the game will give you a sense of the track layout if you're playing the game with a track that you'll actually be driving. Otherwise, the games are a ton of fun and you'll really enjoy playing the game to advance in level within the game, and of course playing head to head with your buddies (whether live or via the 'net on xbox 360) after a few cocktails is tons of fun.

You'll have fun, but the G forces and real life car control aren't there and you'll never get an actual sense of when to brake, turn in, etc... in your car playing these games. At this point in time, these games are no substitute for on track experience. I don't believe they will ever help a driver achieve any appreciable difference in lap times.

Jason

Actually, it might help the other way around. Diving on a real track might help your video game skills. You will have a better understanding of the line, braking ect. and won't crash as much in the game, which will get you more than half way there, in the game.

Very helpful.
Another of my secrets.
PC with Logitech wheel/pedals.
GTR, GTR2, GT Legends, R Factor, SCGT, Viper Racing.
Requires reasonably fast computer and graphics card.
Recommend the following sites;

http://www.nogripracing.com/
http://www.bhmotorsports.com/

Here's me in GT Legends at Road Atlanta http://www.argentlab.com/nasatx/jeff/pics/game_ntsc_RA.wmv

jb

ps Denny Hamlin set pole at Pocono last year.
He had never seen the track except for video game.

I have found that the 4th gen cars in GT3 with the default setup do a good job of duplicating the handling characteristics of the real thing. I have never been lucky enough to have run a track on a video game where I have also run it in real life. However, I truly believe that trying different lines in the video game can translate to improved lines at the real track.

I have TOCA Race Driver 3 for the Playstation 2.
I feel that it is helpful.
It helps me with breaking zones and turn in points.
Also, it helps me with practicing with patience so I do not hit another car.
You are still going to have contact in real life, but maybe it will help reduce incidents.

I think it helps when using the more realistic games. I have GTR2 but with just a laptop it's not the best. I've been researching some simulators lately....as I'm not sure how long I'll be doing the real thing for and some of them seem pretty cool/realistic. I've had a hard time getting the Watkins Glen download to work....the car gets stuck when driving through the pits. That would be a cool comparison if I could get it to work.

I'd like to build a home-grade simulator (seat, pedals, wheel, speakers, LCD, etc.) in the next few years. I've played older TOCAs, but I'd like to try the latest one. I have a copy of Ferarri F355 Challenge (5+ years old and hard to find). Play that one with all of the driver assists turned off and you will experience car control issues just like a real one.

Some of the more expensive simulators, ie: $10k plus may give you some more of the motion and physical effects.

I don't think I'm the best of drivers, but I had plenty of video game experience before I ever tracked my car, and I progressed from beginner to instructor level rather quickly, and some early instructors said I had "natural" ability. Yeah....but then I got to a certain point and like to take the car home and am a big wuss on the brakes......just a tad too early.

I have one of these Gameracer that I use with XBox 360 and Forza 2. I think it helps and I know it's fun.

Tony

I think GTR2 is very helpful (one of the best racing sims, IMHO, and it's only $20 at best buy). It's great to learn a track before you get there. This way you can focus on the car & driving, rather than trying to just get comfortable on a brand new track. The same concepts can be used - learn the line, pick your brake/turn-in, gas, apex, track out points and try small changes when you can run consistent lap times.

Even though you don't feel the g-forces in a video game, the physics are modelled pretty well where the video game car will do what a real car would in the same situation. In GTR2, you can edit the setup files manually to better simulate an f-body (change the gearing, move the center of gravity forward, change the dyno curve to match your car, etc) and really have it simulate your car well. Anyways, video game driving is much harder than real world, so if you can get good at it, it'll be helpful.

You'll want a steering/pedal set. My $80 Logitech Force Feedback is OK, but I just don't have a good feel for the brake (it uses a spring for resistance, so it doesn't feel the same as real brakes). I've heard the G25 is nice.

Realistic driving simulators definately help out with driving basics on track. GTR/GTR2 is the best simulator for modern production cars and is excellent to learn turn-in approaches, threshold braking, and line experimenting. Force-Feedback is excellent and you can actually feel what each corner of the car is doing somehow under braking, accelerating, and cornering. Would not consider time spent with GTR/GTR2 a waste of time at all! To get the most use out of realistic driving simulators the following would be what you would really want if you are serious:

1. Computer capable of running sims
2. Matrox Triple Head to Go with 3 19" LCD monitors for proper field of view
3. Track IR for situational awareness and looking ahead....
4. Logitech G25 Controller (proper wheel diameter and great FFB)
5. Adequate racing seat
6. Good speakers (subwoofer to transmit vibrations for addional input)

One of the best GTR2 videos i've seen for how it drives: GTR2

A little feature I really like about GTR2 is sun glare when you set driving time to sunset/sunrise times...nothing like being blind going into a corner to test if you have your braking points and apexs down... the glare off the track surface adds that little extra bit.

In addion to GTR/GTR2, Netkar Pro (formula car simulator) is considered one of the best racing sims available... NetkarPro

P.S. If you want to try a fun one out for free try Blimey's BMW M3 Challenge (from the creators of GTR, GT Legends, GTR2...) M3 Challenge.com Just have to remember it's a street car on street tires...

Thanks you guys. I just picked up GT3. Will need a good steering wheel. It's not as easy as I thought!!!!!!!!

Nothing compares to seat time on the actual track in your track car and reviewing the tapes afterward.

Of course, nothing compares to the real thing, but the real thing is expensive and difficult to come by. You can play a game essentially any time. I think its applicable. How useful it is will depend on the realism of the game and the environment you choose to play on.

Okay it may be a little expensive , but I have yet to see a sim even come close to the realism that was affordable for the home. Most it ever did was help with memory of the track layout and that was marginal at best. I will default to the real thing and leave the sims for passing the time with friends.

No, you get absolutely no fedback to what the car is doing. A video game is 100% out of touch with the chassis feel. It is not even going to help you with a line because the car in the game has different charateristics than that of the braking zone and pedaling of the throttle and brakes of your real car.

The ONLY thing a video game is good for is learning a track like Limerock, or Watkins Glen, Etc where you get a bit used to blind sections of the track before you actually drive on them for real.

I play GT-4 quite a bit, but not for learning tracks. I just drive lots of different tracks and Nurburgring-Nordschleife to keep in practice of looking ahead and keep my reactions up. Plus I have a modified third-gen Camaro and kind of "feels" similar to my car.

Spend some time with GTR2 (a racing SIMULATION, not video game) then see if you truely feel the same way afterwards... You will learn about being consistent and keeping on the line. And you will learn about how your line must change as the tires wear and fuel gets low along with the track changing from rubber buildup and temperature shifts. Even though the G force is missing from the equation like in real life you can feel what the tires are doing and balance the cars grip as in real life. Someone who has never been on track before can learn how to drive properly on track in GTR2 - proper race/driving theory applies to GTR2. It doesn't feel exactly the same (no G's), nor is truely as fun as being on track in real life, but a person can become a competent driver (get the mechanics of driving a car on track down) and be way ahead of the curve before ever setting one wheel on a real track.

Donnington National in a Porsche GT3 RSR is just too much fun! Makes me want to drive a real Porsche 911 GT3 RSR if I ever get a chance...

Does anyone have a Pontiac Trans Am or Camaro for GTR2???

Whats the best steering wheel/pedal combo out? I see there is a porsche steering wheel w/h gate shifter and realisting clutch and brake pedal feel. That is for PC and PS3.

What games have Midwest Tracks? Mid-O? Road America?

Logitech G25.
Visit http://www.bhmotorsports.com/ and http://www.nogripracing.com/

jb

I have a celeron 2.4, 1G RAM and a GeForce 6500/256.

Is that a fast enough machine to run GTRx?

It may run, but it will be pretty borderline. I just upped my system to 2GB, and a GEFORCE 7800 video card and it runs i decent now.....it still slows down a bit in traffic.

Well, I used some of my bonus to upgrade the PC.

Asus MB
Quad Duo 2.8
4GB
8800GTS 512M
Logitach G25

blah, blah, blah

And have been running GT Legends.

It certainly doesn't have the same feel as the real thing.
But it is helping me smooth out my technique, experiment with chassis tuning scenarios and fine tune coordination.

It was a chunk of change and switching PCs is a royal PITA. I hope it will pay dividends.

When I have time to kill in the winter a few beers and sitting down with GT4 on a track doing time trials chasing my ghost replay does seem to help. What I try and do is find time each lap and that is one hell of a way to do it. It teaches you line and where time is and is not in a lap. People can say that it doesn't help and it's not realistic but there are a lot of young F1 and Cup drivers that use it to learn tracks and lines. It's not going to get you turning your head, looking in the right spots and getting your inner ear canal a work out but it will get you thinking better, evaluating tracks for where you leave time out there AND it's got to help hand eye.

Funny story, back in college I would have GT2 on the Playstation at a party and some new kid would come over and want to race. My buddies would offer up a pitcher of beer at the bar for a bet and I would sweeten the deal with a slow car or a lap lead, something way out to lunch just to get the kid to race. Then just put a beating down on him, my buddies loved it since they knew it was about a sure things as bets go!

Bret