Hey guys.

Since this month I've turned 36 and hit middle age, the one thing I have always wanted to do more and haven't been able to is run multiple track days per year, run Nasa TT events, and possibly get my instructors certificate. Over the course of discussions with my wife we both kept coming back to "understanding the costs". So I was trying to put together a "business plan" (for lack of a better term) that would capture the costs of multiple lapping days in my 1991 Z28 camaro. I've done 10-15 track events over the last 8 years but never have been able to do more than 1-2 in a calender year.

Here is what I have so far:

• Event Cost $250 per day (approx)
• Tires $600 set (how many events can I expect? My Nitto 555R2's have 3 track days on them and could maybe do 1 more)
• Brake pads $ 125 Front/ $95 rear (I've had my Hawk HP+ pads for 4-5 years (4-5 events +limited street use)
• Rotors $122 set front/ $196 set rear (C5 front/ stock 91 Z28 rear)
• Brake fluid $20 Liter 2 per year? (flush/ fill after every event)
• Gas for event ~8 Gal/ session @$4.00 (5 sessions per day) = $160.00
• Travel (Gas etc) Based on distance
• Food $25 per day
• Hotel if needed $100/ night (hope to do 1 day events close to home)

I'm trying to boil these costs down to a $ per track Day type of number.
I know most people don't want to know how much the addiction costs, but I need ammo to convince my wife it fits in the budget.

Thanks

If you attempt to justify the expenditures, it is a futile effort.

Just do as I do ... be grumpy as hell a couple weeks before an event and when you come back, be relaxed, low key and very sensitive.

Your wife will ENCOURAGE your participation.

If that doesn't work, show her the cost of a new set of golf clubs, golf cart, lessons, country club dues and green fees. Don't forget the new Escalade required to haul all the equipment and the golf swag required to play. Include pictures of the hot girls that attend golf tounaments and follow the players around the course.

That should seal the deal ...

That works.......

IMO justifying a hobby just makes it more discouraging for you... Good luck tho! ;-)

I'm not really justifying it to me, just want to be careful about how it affects the household budget!

I think you are doing well, just put this on Excel and then modify it as the "real" expenses occur. When I started doing this David Vodden, CEO of Thunderhill Park out west here, asked me to compare my street school days (HPDE) to racing. It was real close! So I went racing......

I think your tire cost is low. And a few of the others are a bit high...but that is all in the noise for planning purposes. The towing and perdiem is what kills you if you cant stay close to home. Plus you need to put something in for breakage.

Guess you wont be needin any beer... Can you say second job? Just kiddin.

What I do is secretly save up some money behind the wife's back. Then when i spend house money, I match it with the savings money and it looks like the racing is costin about half what it really is. Like when you get an expense check from work, just slip it in your savings account. This may not work in your situation, especially if the wife pays the bills.

The only other thing I can offer is to try to match up the racing with the cost of things that she may do as a hobby. Again this may not work too well, plus racing is notoriously expensive when comparing it to getting your nails done or buying a new purse or shoes.

You could also use your talents to find a sponsor! And Find a local racer to dump their 5 heat cycle tires on your doorstep.

Good luck. An inheritance from old Aunt Gertrude seems to work the best.

Bock

Run street tires, they last longer. My ($298 to my door in a 16" size) Sumitomo summer tires ran quite well at Nashville and in several autocrosses after that. Are they as fast as race tires? Nope, but they don't have a points chase in HPDE classes (and no matter what tires you run, you won't "win" the class). These tires are wearing like iron and I still had fun on track with them. Switching to street tires to allow the budget to go a bit farther is probably the best advice I can give you.

When I looked at $250-$600 for towing, $250 a day for entry, added tire wear, brake wear and incidentals. Then toss in for track fuel. I was looking at about $1k a weekend (for most events). This does not count wear on the engine and trans (they will fail/need rebuilt sometime). That's a gross over simplification of my costs, but it's pretty close to the reality I was looking at when I started to make the calculations you're making.

I did 15 event days last year in a 2001 SS. Here are my suggestions on how to justify it:

1. Front full race pads $160 (will go 6 days) the backs will last the entire year. Go cheap as they provide less than 30% of the stopping.
2. Rotors- switch back to the stock front rotors with venting. The C5 conversion adds tremendous cost and they bust more frequently. The stock front rotors are $25 (last about 6 days) at Autozone and they come with a year warranty. (My integrity limits free exchanges to once per purchased set.)
3. Brake fluid- get the Autozone DOT 4 and change it every three days. We aren't in F1 so we don't need the gold standard.
4. Don't come home and tell stories of other people wrecking their cars, doing any type of body damage, or having major mechanical failures.
5. If you are pulling your trailer with her SUV/truck make time to completely clean it after the event weekend.
6. Don't complain and wine every time she comes home with a $20 trinket she or the kids don't need. She could nickel and dime you for a year and not waste enough money to equal a 3 day track weekend!
7. Let her know that the beauty of this type of hobby is that you can completely stop it at anytime. You can cut the cost basis to Zero for a year and then pick it back up again if something comes up. This isn't the case with horses, country club dues, large boats, time shares, second homes....

Let your wife know this is going to cost in excess of $5k a year plus any mission critical mechanical failures. Let her know it makes you feel like a man and you grow as a person every weekend!

Since we've moved beyond budget to tactics to keep the Significant Other placated, I'd suggest that the best route to keeping your hobby alive is to get the missus hooked as well. My wife decided to go racing back in '99 - '00, and I dutifully went along and caught up on my reading, tended to some minor work stuff, and drank beer after hours. After a while I started changing wheels. Then I did a track day in my car. Despite a rock ding to my precious street car, I came back and eventually was hooked. Yeah, it's the opposite of the norm, but it could be that your wife would love to be involved. Get her hooked, and you're golden. Once both partners are addicts you can enable each other.

Hey, the kids can go to community college, and don't need an inheritance if they're successful in business. Right?

Jason

I quit keeping track after a HD crashed and I lost the spreadsheet.

Here's my saying: Racing budget? Hahahaha.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I seem to remember Chris tracking before the marriage!

I'm still wondering how he hit middle age at only 36....

Yep, get the wife to go

Once you start instructing, the club typically comps the entry fee, and that opens the door for the occaisional paying gig. You will not make a profit, but a hotel room, meal or tank of gas once in a while helps. As far as managing the S.O., you can claim that you have to do this because you are getting paid or getting something free, or just not mention that and skim the entry costs off the budget for 'upgrades'. Whatever works.

My estimates always came in at about $600/day figuring tire wear, brake wear, fuel in car, fuel in truck, hotel, food, etc.

I just can't bring myself to figure out the costs. I think I'd cry.

The Minister of Finance (my wife) handles all our money. So, I basically schedule races until she tells me to stop. Then I take a month or two off, and start over.

The comped entry is a double edged sword, especially if you have multiple groups you instruct with.
Tires, brakes and fuel cost escalate significantly when given all this "free" track time.

I have a paying gig at texas motorspeedway, driving someone else's cars. It's great "work". But it's 80 miles from my door to the front gate. At today's fuel prices, most of the paycheck is used at the fuel pump. I've ridden my MC a couple times to the gig, but I'm usually pretty tired and sore at the end of a LONG day.

While not an ideal situation behind the wheel, it's a LOT worse in the saddle.

Thanks for all the replies guys. I realize like any other hobby it isn't cost justified, but I don't do it for the fiancial benefit. Putting all the previous costs in a spreadsheet gets me (for 4 events in a year) at a cost of around $3,000 for the year ($750-800 per event) if I drive to the track instead of towing. I figure the 4 closest tracks are (or will be when they are complete) within 3 hrs of the house. www.drivebluegrass.com will be less than 40 min and it will be done next spring.

For some of the other comments:

Bock: Why is my tires costs low? Expecting too many events out of a set or cost per set? I payed right about $600 shiped for the last set, but I guess I should add mount + balancing + rotation (side to side) pretty often. Maybe another $200 for a set? And as far as the "toolbox fund" how do you think I paid for the LS1 swap! (btw, I was tracking that until my flash card crapped out and gave up after that ~$8-9000 for the swap to date.)

Marty: thanks for the suggestions. I agree about most of them but I won't skimp on the C5 brakes since we all know how weak the original 3d gen brakes were. Heck even the 1LE is weak compared to the C5/ LS1 Fbody setup. Besides, it was the "reason" I had to go to 17" (and now 18") street rims.

I became middle aged at 36 for the sole purpose of extra leverage in the "Honey, I need to start my bucket list" discussion.

I got her to ride for 3 laps at Roebling road back around 2003 and she was screaming for me to pit before I had even warmed up the tires (not sure if that reflects badly on me or what). She is great and puts up with alot, but gets easily carsick so I doubt she'll ever get addicted.

I used street tires up until NFME '03 when CCBock let me "borrow" his Victoracers (damn enabler!) and I just love the extra grip. + the way I drive I can rip through a set of street tires almost as fast as the Nitto's.

I have found the best trick is to look my wife in the eye and say "I really really enjoy doing this."

I have only been twice, but for per day costs here goes:

$100 tear tires (estimated)
$70 front pads (my front pads only make it 1 track day)
$20 rear pads (I can probably get 2 or 3 days out of them)
$42 front disks (they get scored up, and are so cheap I just replace them)
$120 brake fluid (Have to flush before and after, am hoping for more longevity with Castrol)
$100 gas
$195 track fee
$270 hubs (unfortunately it looks like I have joined the "hub a day" club)
$10 lunch
$priceless enjoyement

$800 approximate total

My local track, http://www.millermotorsportspark.com is hard on brakes, there is a good straight before almost every turn. Also, my LT1 brakes are undersized, bigger brakes would probably do better. FWIW, my brakes last forever in street and autocross use. I'm going to improve my brake ducts (they helped alot) and see if I can get further benefit. If Castrol SRF can survive a track day then I might be money ahead. I'm also hoping Timken hubs are tougher than the generics I had last time.

You might be able to get by on the $600 if you go with street tires. and they will last a little longer. But once you get addicted to the grip, its hard to go back.

The last set of R compound tires I bought (a month ago) cost me right at $1100 shipped, mounted & balanced. I also got the car aligned but that was $110 extra (my car is too low to easily get it onto the rack). And prices go up with the price of oil. I will grant you that they are Kumho 315-35-17 but the Nittos you would likely use are probably up to around 160-170 each at least...without any shipping etc.

The R compound tires (general statement here, I know there are exceptions) start to go away after about 5 or 6 heat cycles. The racers with good sponsors only use em once (or twice at practice)...but we arent trying to set any records. My Viper buddy pitches his tires after 5 heat cycles, whether or not they have any tread left. My experience has been that I can get about 4 events (4-5, 20 minute sessions=1 event) and I run them righ down to the cords. Some tracks are worse than others. For example, Memphis is really easy on tires.

YMMV

Bock

"Well there's your problem!"

If you want to save money and can handle not setting any track records, then start buying takeoffs for tires. You spent $1100 on new tires. Wouldn't you rather spend $400 on a set that someone else qualified on? They may only last 3 events, instead of 4 - but you're still saving thousands on tires per year!

Toyo RA1s suck ... but they suck for a long time. ! can go a whole season racing on 6 tires.

Rotate the spares into the mix, flip them and pay attention to which tire takes the worst pounding at a specific track.

It takes diligence, but R compounds can last longer than 5 or 6 heat cycles.

Also, tune and practice on scrubs. Save the good stuff for the race.

You might want to consider getting some budget friendly Hooser Grand Am Cup scuffs. They are dirt cheap and last a long time. In fact, you probably won't wear them out before they get old. They are far from being the best performing tire (so I'm told), but for track days who cares. I can't afford to use street tires for what I pay for them ~$250 a set. I even get them mounted by the team that I get them from for $20 / set.

I've have 3 track days on my set (that’s it?) and I really can't see much tread loss, except a little on the corners since I have them squeezed on too small of a rim. Another guy that has gone to the track many more times than I in the last 2 years is still using the same set on his mustang. I'm guessing that he has 8-15 track days on them and they were scuffed when he got them.

If you are competing you might want to pay the extra coin for something better, but for OT I don't see why you'd want to. There are some people that say they suck, which is fine, but they grip better than street tires and cost a lot less. I've never tried anything else, so maybe I'm really "missing it", but I can't see spending 1k on a set of tires for what I do at this point in time.

And they are pretty light. My 275/35/18's weigh 44 lbs mounted on a 20.5 lb wheel

As far as my track day costs go:
$150 3ballsracing.com or waterfordhills.com I haven't tried NASA yet mostly because I'm finding cheaper events and I'm waiting until the car and I are ready for TT.
Gas: $163 driving a car w/o OD getting 15 mpg on 93 octane to and from an event that is 2.5 hours away. MPG w/ tuning will get better, but I was also babying the motor at the last event since it is "off".
Brake pads: $180/5 I must be babying these things b/c I have 5 events plus street miles on XP8's and they are still half there. C5 rotors are holding up fine so far.
Tires: cheap, see above
Food: $6 one meal. 3balls gets pizza for lunch
Hotel: none
Incidentals: who the heck knows. $112 for a WBO2 sensor this last time.

Ok heres a good change to the thread. You are getting hooser grand am scuffs, which are 18". How about 274/40/17's (that what I run on stock 2000 SS wheels now) I have upgraded to 18" rims for the street but ASSuMEd that the 17" rims would cost me less for open track tires.

so here are some ?'s

1) where/ how did you find your source?
2) does any series run 17" tires that can be gotten for cheap?

I'd love to find someone to beg used tires from, that is one of (but not the most) expensive parts of the budget.

I get mine from Dean Martin at Rehagen Racing. I can get you his email address tonight. If you can find a local source you won't have to pay for shipping which will be roughly $25/tire.

They used 17's on their older mustang. I'm not sure if they still use them or not, but he charged more for 17's since there was more demand for them. The 18's were cheaper.

I have them squeezed onto a 9.5" rim now but they call for a 10-10.5. I have 10.5" Z06 wheels in the basement waiting for tires.