Anyone here have any experience with Amsoil products? I'm a little curious about their PS fluid, and motor oil.

used it when had motorcycle... worked well... but ended up going with motul... well rated and much cheaper.
Everyone seems to say it's excellent but pricey, in the bike industry... in car industry, i don't hear it much.

I began running their 2000 series 20W50 in the CMC car middle of last year.

My sponsor offered it to me at cost, which is less than Mobil 1 15W50 at Wal-Mart.

I run 3 weekends on a change. That would be 9 races (6 20 minute and 3 40 minute), 6 qualifying session, 3 practice sessions and typically a handful of TnT sessions. Each session, the temps see 300* as measured in the oil pan.

The last change, I took a sample, but have yet to send it to Blackstone ...

If it weren't for my sponsor, I wouldn't use it as it is very pricey. But it really does seem to hold up well.

At 300 degrees, I'm seeing 30psi at idle.

Pimpmaro here on the board is an amsoil dealer (shameless plug). If you need anything, he may be able to help you out.

Sorry I didn't see this earlier, I have a final exam today but after that I'm done for the quarter. If you need any information or just have some questions I'm happy to talk shop about it. Just shoot me a PM or an email.

I'll probably be back in this thread later today.

I've been using the 10w-30 full syn in both cars for about a year. We have a local rep that gets it for me for less than I was paying for M-1. So far I'm very happy with it. They also have rediesigned filters which seem very good, but they are a bit pricey.

I use their oils in all my cars and have been very happy with them.

I don't want to come off as trying to slide a sales pitch in, but I actually became a dealer because of the research I had done on Amsoil when I was looking into purchasing it for use in my car. The downside was I couldn't find any dealers near me at the time, then I was talked into it by a coworker at the airport who is actually my sponsor dealer.

Concerning the lubes, I've always found that Amsoil's test numbers greatly exceed the numbers produced by the majority of other lubricants. Those other oils that are in the same ballpark as amsoil are only marginally better in only some of the tests. The tests I'm referring to include the 4 ball wear test, the Noack volatility test, the pour point, flash point, and fire point. The other numbers I looked at were the viscosity ratings on the cst scale. I found out that mobil 1 5w30 is actually extremely low in the cst range for that weight oil. That means that as the oil wears, it thins out to below the recommended range for a 30 weight oil and below what I would be comfortable with using in my car. I'll be the first to admit that there definitly are other good oils out there, but those numbers are the ones I'd look at heavily to make my decision, that and oil analysis. I can't remember who Amsoil uses, but I use blackstone. I've been with them before I ever started dealing amsoil and I prefer to have an opinion from someone not affiliated with the oil company.

In terms of the filters, we just came out with a line of what's called nano fiber filters. The idea is to get a filter that can trap smaller particles and provide more flow. They use stronger, thinner fibers packed in a more dense weave. The result is a higher percentage of flow area in the filter versus the area consumed by the media, but at the same time, the openings between the media fibers are smaller which trap the smaller particles. The new oil filters are designed to be used up to 25,000 mile intervals (I won't go that long with autocrossing) and the new air filters are designed to go 100,000 miles with only blowing them out with air to clean them. No more oils, which by the way is my pet peeve with the K&N line. I know K&N flows more than a paper filter with no oil (as they always are in the "test stand" displays at the store), but I'm not so sure that once you oil them, they flow any more than a paper filter. Personally, I use a purolator air filter right now.

Oh that's probably enough boring reading for you all for now.

No hard evidence to back it up, but my 2 favorites are amsoil 5-30 and when I can find it the german castrol 0-30 that everyone raves about. I've come accross it a few times, and buy the place out when I do.

For me, both idle at just under 40psi when hot (80deg day, back to back to back autocross runs idling in between). My car is quite the piston slapper, neither seem to make it any better. I did notice a difference cold starting in the winter when I switched to the castrol 0 weight from m1 5-30. The m1 0-40 was pretty good too though, and is my 3rd choice when I am fealing cheap or lazy.

I'm a Redline guy..... Many reasons, but anyone who saw what it dealt with about 8-10 years ago in Dyson Racing's Riley during the Daytona 24 will be more than convinced.But any prototype that can run for 6 hours or so in any condition, let alone those with 2 dropped valves in 2 different cylinders tells me something about the oil. Something kept that engine semi-alive..........

That's not the only reason I run it but it's a glaring example.

Sam, mostly what I've heard about Redline is that it is excellent as well. I've run it in my car and I had absolutely no problems with it. I know what you mean though about the engine story. Since I became a dealer, I've heard quite a few stories about amsoil as well, everything ranging from one of my sponsor dealers having an off shore racing boat he was sponsoring that lost an oil pump halfway through the race and the engine stayed together all the way to one of my customers gaining 3 mpg when the only thing he did was change to amsoil motor oil, not even changing his other lubes. While hardly scientific, I do think they're good reassurance stories for those of us who swear by our oils. IMO, there are a few oils in the top tier that will all hold together under extreme circumstances and I wouldn't turn my nose up at any of them. At the same time, I obviously have my preference... heh. That's why I wouldn't settle for middle tier oil... which after looking into it, I consider M1 to be (upper end of the range, but I have my biases... Kevin... are you listening? Huh? No more M1 for you!).

I convinced Brion to look into changing the race car over to M1 many years ago. He finally did his research and made the switch. I've seen the car come into the pits/paddock with the 275 degree oil temp gauge pinned (well past 275) where it stayed for 1/2 hour (mechanical gauge from autometer) after the car was shut down. The oil came out the same color it went in (not scientific), and until recently, the motors have stayed together perfectly (the recent problems were not oil related, they were dumb luck related, we had a distributor hold down bend and allow the timing to advance, we lost a freeze plug out of a head, we had a head stud pull out of the block, we had a water neck break and drain the coolant out of the motor and ran 4 laps with no water, etc).

I'd run redline, etc, but I've had good luck with M1 so far.

Blah blah blah... oil comes out the same color... you know that doesn't mean anything!

I run Redline in my car, and M1 in my lawnmower and stuff like that. I'm a big fan of synthetics in general, ever since performing my own loss of oil pressure "endurance test" (several years apart on different cars).

In the dino car, I had to drive about half a block before I could safely pull off the road. That was enough to weld the crankshaft to the bearings.

In the synth car (running Syntec), I drove quite a bit further (in my morning fog) without ever noticing that the guage in front of the gearshift had dropped to zero. I noticed the slick when I was the last to leave work that evening, the night before Thanksgiving. I followed the trail while waiting for my ride to show up After (miraculously) locating a used drain plug for a defunct import car and adding oil, it fired right up and I drove it home. I later checked the compression and it hadn't changed.

I also used to have an old Subaru with valves that would clatter for the first 20 seconds after the first start of the morning running dino. I could hear the exact moment when the oil reached them (or possibly the hydraulic lifters, if it had them). With synthetic (M1, I think), I never heard them at all.

The only engine (with 1, 3, 4, 6, or 8 cylinders) I don't use synth in is my high mileage Dodge. It doesn't seem to have any major oil leaks, but the 5.9 is notorious for leaking into the manifold. Because I don't know what it ran before I got it, I don't want to take a chance on cleaning out the dirt that's plugging the leaks.

My car has one of the "oil-fired" LS1s that needs all the viscosity stability it can get. I also work it hard on Sundays, so it get's the good stuff in 10W-40 One of the main local autocross event sponsors (and the only local speed shop that isn't drag, dirt, or pimp oriented, ) stocks Redline at a competitive price and their shop is on my way to work. That makes Redline the clear winner, and I do think I'm using less oil with Redline than I did with M1 or Royal Purple. The other engines get M1.

I'd run ANY synthetic before ANY dino oil, but I've never had a reason or occasion to try Amsoil.

I also run Redline PS and diff oils, but I use an arcane mix of 3 quarts Pennzoil Synchromesh plus 1 quart Havoline D3 dino ATF in the T56. I blew a hose off the fill pump, made an AWFUL mess, and had to top off with what I had on hand. Pennzoil confimed that there were no chemical compatibility issues and it shifts fine, so I'm still running it

Nope, but that little 302 lived for 3+ years of racing (many track hours) with an 8,000 rpm redline (or so) and only died when it snapped a rod bolt. So, even with the elevated temps, we finally stretched a rod bolt to death, but the motor was running strong until that bolt fractured (the bearing didn't spin). And you know Brion's ability to blow stuff up. So, that little motor took a beating on M1 and never seemed to care one bit.

I agree with Sean, I'm crazy about synthetics. I've never heard anything bad about Amsoil. I use Redline in the Camaro because it's easier to get and costs about the same as Amsoil. I use Valvoline synthetic oil in my truck and the wifes Honda becuase I don't need the super high temp protection of Redline in either of those vehicles.

In 1980, we bought a "Buck" woodstove (my parents did). In reading the book, dad stumbled across the note that you are supposed to pull the unit, remove the fan and motor and lube the motor with oil (due to the extreme heat seen by the blower on the back of the firebox). They specifically told you to use Mobile 1 for this purpose. So, for about 20 years, dad had a can (yes a real can) with an oil spout shoved in it sitting on the shelf in our garage. It worked great on that stove and never seemed to mind the extreme heat (and this was the 1980 forumulation). M1 has been making oil for a long time and if they are not the best, they surely are not the worst. I run it because it works for me in my applications. I'd rather run Redline, but I'm cheap. I'd consider Amsoil, but it's too frustrating to get it. I tend to buy oil on "oil change day" (which was last night in our VW) and not in advance. That alone pretry much rules out Amsoil for me.

I run XYZ and haven't had an issue or the color/smell is nice. Oil can be black and have a lot more life left or it can be amber and ready to be changed.

I run the german made 0w30 Castrol Syntec year round. It's provided the best oil analysis results in my particular car (and a lot of other LT1/LS1 cars) for my use. Mobil 1 did a decent job as well, but it could've been better. I've been meaning to switch over to Redline and run an analysis on it, but the numbers I have right now are awfully good so I haven't had much motivation.



I'd challenge the validity and relevance ofthose tests in indicating how an oil will perform in an actual car. But I too trust used oil analysis more than anything. It isn't the end all and be all, but it holds a lot more water than those lab tests.

I completely agree Rob, but I really use those to determine what I feel comfortable putting in my car, and then turning around and getting an oil analysis done on it to see how it works.

Oh and Kevin, Amsoil was the first synthetic even though I know M1 has been doing it a long time. I also believe M1 uses a petroleum base-stock in their synthetic oils.

I really don't care what base stocks were used to create the synthetic. All I care about is the properties of the result. If petroleum stock can be used as the raw material to create a good synthetic (and I don't know that it can or can't), I don't have a problem with that.

If an oil can provide good cold flow and good protection under adverse conditions (high operating temps, sudden loss of oil pressure, etc), and good wear protection, I don't care if it's made from turkey guts and dog poop.

In my past experience, dino oils aren't good enough, but that doesn't mean a synthetic made from them is also inadequate.

Yup. They engineer "designer" synthetic oil from a base stock that was originally real oil. I'm with Sean, I don't care as long as it works.

Personally if I'm running a synthetic, I want a synthetic.....

Things that are "engineered" are still organic bases with a lot of additives in them. Highly refined, yes, but still carbon based.

The whole idea with synthetics is the oil stretches like a plastic bag does when sheered. That's instead of tearing like a paper bag does. Oil works the same way. And I've personally witnessed Mobil 1 filled cars spin bearings when completely topped up with oil. That, among other things that I've seen tells me the bearing film isn't offering protection when you need it.

Frankly, with the standards now, even "junk" oil is fine for normal driving. But I'm not a normal driver, the G's, the sloshing, the high RPM, the heat. If you aren't going to have a problem then any oil, be it Mobil 1, or $.99/quart Mobil junk will be fine. The proof is when something happens like Sean had.

And FWIW, Exxon/Mobil can kiss my ass.

Actually, Amsoil has also played the group III base stock "synthetic" labeling game in some of their line. Mobil as hated as it is by some is just about the only over the counter oil that hasn't done so. Mobil has always been group IV unless something has changed recently. I know at one point it was a pao/ester (group V) blend but I beleive that has changed.


I really don't care though, the german made (not us) Castrol in my car works well. It was analyzed by Terry Dyson who has extensive experience with racing engines and has worked with NASCAR teams IIRC. (You can opt for Terry through Blackstone Labs). Unfortunately I lost the report he did on my car. But he approved of me running the oil for approx 200 autocross runs plus a certain amount of street mileage per change. Mobil 1 didn't perform awfully, but it didn't reach this level.

Wanna share some of the story ??? :intrigued:

Rob,

Are you using the green or the gold German stuff?

Edit: Why this is related: Castrol switched formulations a while ago on its German 0w30 and people are still debating whether the new (gold) is better than the old (green colored) stuff. If it's not as good, then it'll be time to switch to something else, be it Amsoil, Redline or another...

Pimpmaro: What version of Amsoil would you recommend, given that our cars seem to run best with a 40-weight or near 40-weight.

-John

To clarify, I'm not certainly not saying that they are all the same, only that I don't have any philosophical qualms about how a good synthetic oil is made if the result is good.

Per the Mobil/Castrol lawsuit, Group III oils can legally be sold as synthetic, but it may be more reasonable to call them highly refined rather than synthetic. I don't have much or any experience with these as far as i know.

Group IV oils (PAOs) are actually synthetic, but the raw material still comes from oil. They may not be the best available, but they are (in my experience) a lot better than "conventional" oils. Mobil One is an example.

Group V oils (the esters) are also organic in origin and made from chains of carbon and hydrogen, just not from "fossil" sources. Whether that is sufficent to call them "hydrocarbons" I do not know. As far as I know, the main "pure" Group V oils are Redline, Motul, and Amsoil.

Most of my "stress testing" of synthetic predated the Group III oils as far as I know, so they were probably Group IV at the time (though at least one is now a Group III). Personally, I suspect that the MAIN problem with Mobil One is that the established specs are wide and Mobil tends to run at the thin end (which is probably what the OEMs want for gas mileage). In other words, you might want to select a thicker nominal grade from M1 to get the same actual viscosity as a thinner nominal grade of some other oil. Is that a marketing problem? Sure. Is it a technical problem? Maybe not, if you select is based on the data sheets instead of by the label (and in fact, I also use the Redline datasheets instead of the labels).

Are the Group Vs better under extreme conditions? Maybe, at least today, and it's cheap insurance for the car I race, so it gets Redline. Given the amount of oil it consumes, and that fact that it has run sythetic all along and should be fairly clean inside except for the carbonized combustion chambers, a Group V is probably also the best choice for keeping it clean.

My analysis was of the old green German stuff. I just switched to gold. I've seen similar results from the gold formula so I don't see anything wrong with running it. I may take an early sample this summer to check it back out.

And the funny thing is despite what some are saying in this thread Mobil's base stock is a true synthetic (PAO). I agree on the viscosity it is slightly thin for a 30 weight, but it doesn't thin out over time as much as the conventional oils (Tri-syn did some but SuperSyn is better). I think it gets a bad rap because some people run it at too high an oil temp for it's viscosity and/or have oiling issues and want to blame the oil.

Of course Redline is going to be a better oil for racing-that is what it's designed for. It is group V base oil and is LOADED with moly and other additives and costs a lot more than Mobil 1 where I live. So it's really comparing apples to oranges. Run Mobil 1 10w30 on a road course or in an environment it's not suited for and it's your own fault.

When I had a two driver car I ran Mobil 1 Delvac 5w40 (diesel engine oil) to deal with the higher temps. I run german castrol again now and I look for a filter with a good balance of flow and filtration.

I took a little bit of time to read up on GC today and it looks like good stuff but I've grown up on old school oil ways (10w40 summer, 10w30 winter, go up viscosity on an old motor, etc). My dad scoffed at the idea when I put the recommended 5w30 (I used plain old Castrol) in it for the last oil change in the tow van, "That's way too light!".

Would GC work well in a tow rig (Ford 4.6L E-150)? Everything I've read points that it should be fine, but I figure asking the gurus can't hurt.

From what I can dig up evidently Redline is a PAO/Ester blend, but I nor can anyone else on bobistheoilguy determine how much is ester and how much is pao.



I'm not a guru by any mean but:

With a quality oil like GC the 0w30 spread is no big deal. It's actually almost a 40 weight at operating temp IIRC. It would probably be a fine oil for that application. Where you get into trouble with a large spread like 5w30 or 10w40 with conventional oils is you have to add a lot of viscosity index improvers. These oils are more prone to thinning out with use unlike a 10w30. You may start out with 5w30 and end up with 5w20.

www.bobistheoilguy.com

Interesting ... Redline doesn't claim to use only Group V (ester) base stocks. They only claim that their oil contains ester stock.

My LT4 does that on M1, wonder if switching to Amsoil/Redline would help with that?

I ran M1 in my LT1 from the first change at 1400 miles to around 98K miles. It always had a bit of clatter at all temps and some piston slap when cold. Never really gave it much thought since I got pretty good oil analysis results with M1.

I then changed to Redline (same viscosity - 5W30). ALL clatter and slap ceased.

I have no tech beyond my personal experience. The damn engine is quieter now at 107,000 miles than it was at 107 miles.

FWIW I still run M1 in my truck and the wife's GTP. These vehicles see too many miles for me to justify using mail order oil in them. Oil analysis results look just fine and neither one of them gets driven near as hard as my car anyway.