How much hp/tq would you consider the minimum for a daily driver? Think 2 door econobox in major city traffic, NYC, Chicago etc. The significant other and I have been looking at cars and while she's been focusing heavily on mpg I don't want to try to pass someone and step on the gas and have it make noise and continue at the same speed. I've driven a dodge neon 5 years ago that was dangerously slow.


I've been thinking along 130/130 give or take, any comments?

Depends on the weight of the car too. Better to think in terms of acceleration ability. I would generally like to see at least an 8.5 second 0-60 time with a daily driver and a 17 second 1/4 mile. Of course, those are minimums. To feel "just right" I like a 0-60 in the low 5s and a 12 second 1/4 mile. "Fast" is anything quicker than that, to me.

Neons are in the 130hp range.
I have a '98 Neon that I use for going to and from work. It is does quite well as long as I am the only person in it. Put 2 or 3 more poeple in it and it becomes quite a dog.

The Neon is about the minimum I would want in a car.

I have on 06 Corolla 5spd that has 126hp. It feels like a dog all the time. I guess it's ok on the highway if the revs are up (65-85mph), but sucks bigtime in the 35-45 range in 4th gear or if the A/C is on. Man is it dead if you try to pull away from a light when you roll from about 10mph in 2nd gear. I think my track car accelerates harder in 4th gear than the Corolla in 1st gear.

MPG is good though! Everything else is cheap too, tires, brakes, etc.

It all comes down to weight. My old "98 Neon ACR made 114 HP at the wheels, but was more than a fun ride both on the track and as a commuter vehicle. Even as a 4 dr. the car was light enough and had good enough gearing to be plenty sporty. As long as you didn't play too much it returned 33-36 mpg. Look at the performance of Civic Hatchbacks, CRXs and Del Sols, none are big HP cars, but they all perform amazingly well in stock trim with manual transmissions. My son's "89 Civic DX hatch has a 1500cc motor and performs ridiculously well with nothing more than a cheap header and a cat back exhaust. Even with him flogging it non-stop, it averages 34 mpg. Small beaters are the way to go for fun basic transportation in the era of $3 gas. JMO.

One other major factor besides weight, gearing. Overall though, when I look for cars, I look at several things: HP/TQ, weight, acceleration, MPH and reliability. Then once I've picked which cars to consider I start test driving. Some that sound good on paper just don't measure up in person.

The 98 Civic EX is mainly the wifes car, but I love driving that little thing. It has no power at highway speed, but around the DC metro area I never get to see highway speed unless I'm driving at 3 am. I enjoy driving that car because it's so light and tossable. 132HP is fine for commuting in a car that's around 2500 lbs.

In addition one of the things I look at is parts. My sister has a '93 Honda Civic and a lot of the parts for it are much more than my '00 GM pickup. the distributor went out on it and cost a fortune. I'd trade a couple mpg for good cheap parts availability. Look at basic wear items and at some sensors and electronics on autozone.com for a comparison.

That being said my girlfriend has a 5-speed '98 protege I'm going to take over when she gets a new car. I did a full tune up and the costs were reasonable, but I haven't checked into brakes and other wear items.

I had a 97 Pontiac GTP and loved it. The safety of a midsized vehicle. 240 hp on a supercharged V6 and 27mpg overall. Almost zero mechanical issues in 240k miles. I see this things everyday used at decent money


The GF has a Honda Accord -- It is growing on me.

I'm all for fun beaters, but I just don't feel comfortable in really small cars. No matter how cheap they are. I can't really complain about my Malibu, 170hp, 27mpg, reliable, comfy, it goes when you ask it to, and it's cheap on replacement parts.

With that said, I'm looking at the 240hp G6 that gets almost the same mpg.

She commented yesterday that the corolla only gets 28 mpg and I kind of gave up in defeat then. I think we're going to be riding in my truck alot more than her new car. I'm with you slowTA, I want some metal between me and everyone else. She wants MPG, cheap and small though.

Sit down with her and punch out some actual numbers. For example...

If you average 200 miles of driving a week.

In a car that averages 35mpg, that's 5.71 gallons of fuel a week. @ 3.00 even, that $17.14 a week spent on gas.

In a car that averages 25mpg, that's 8 gallons of fuel a week, costing you $24 a week.

So that extra 10mpg equates to just under 7 bucks a week saved, roughly 28 bucks a month, or $364 a year.

MPG, in and of itself, is too ambiguous a measurement. Convert it into a far more tangible figure, ie money coming out of your pocket and going into the tank. Base your decisions on THAT figure.

When the prices started rising a few years ago, I actually did contemplate a change in daily driver. Getting an extra 10mpg really did sound like a good switch, but when I ran the important numbers, it turned out to be a rather meager difference from my perspective. 7 bucks a week is chump change to me. I won't even start considering a change in vehicle until the difference exceeds 20 bucks a week.

And just for reference, it would require gas prices to exceed $6.60 a gallon for the price difference to hit 20 bucks a week. Basically, things are gonna have to get a LOT worse before I stop driving my TA everywhere.