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> The new to me 2002 Z28 (convertible)
GCrites80s
post Jan 16 2018, 02:12 AM
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QUOTE (CrashTestDummy @ Jan 15 2018, 09:37 AM) *
I really wonder how many are truly synthetic, since the feed stock for just about any carbon-based product is oil, or oil byproducts. Once any oil gets out of the refinery, I suspect that all of it could be labeled 'synthetic'. Kind of surprised they don't label the oil as 'organic'. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)


I bought organic white lithium grease for use when greasing the laser rails of video game systems at work. The store was out of regular white lithium grease and only had the organic. Organic in this context meaning made from plant matter rather than minerals. It was cheap too -- I guess since it had no real lithium.
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trackbird
post Jan 16 2018, 02:40 AM
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QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Jan 15 2018, 07:44 PM) *
QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 12 2018, 06:17 PM) *
If you lift the rear wheels off the ground, do the rear wheels spin when you have the car in gear and the clutch depressed? I'm trying to determine if your clutch is dragging.


So it is easier to just take a video, I can hear the clutch disc but I'm not sure if that is normal, never tried this test before.

https://youtu.be/xKfzDukRGQ0


It might need the clutch bled or it could be the beginning of hydraulic issues, though those usually happen pretty quickly and things go south in a hurry.
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mikedamageinc
post Jan 16 2018, 12:34 PM
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QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 15 2018, 09:40 PM) *
It might need the clutch bled or it could be the beginning of hydraulic issues, though those usually happen pretty quickly and things go south in a hurry.


I just bled it recently and the fluid was pretty clean. The master is a Luk, slave the latest AC Delco version and both are only a couple years old.

Should that noise not be there when the wheels turn?
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trackbird
post Jan 17 2018, 11:53 AM
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QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Jan 16 2018, 07:34 AM) *
QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 15 2018, 09:40 PM) *
It might need the clutch bled or it could be the beginning of hydraulic issues, though those usually happen pretty quickly and things go south in a hurry.


I just bled it recently and the fluid was pretty clean. The master is a Luk, slave the latest AC Delco version and both are only a couple years old.

Should that noise not be there when the wheels turn?


That noise may just be a brake rotor rubbing a bit (nothing is ever perfectly flat for long on these cars). Lift the back, put it in park or 1st gear and spin the rear wheel by hand. I suspect you'll hear the same noise.

However, and I may be incorrect, I thought these cars had enough clutch disengagement that the rear wheels would stay stationary with the motor running and the clutch pedal depressed. I know it can drag a little due to tight clearances, but I don't remember how much drag I've seen from other cars. If I get the front end of mine back off the ramps (I still have to put the power steering lines and pump on it, if it ever gets warm in the garage) I can lift it and do the same test for you.
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mikedamageinc
post Jan 17 2018, 01:52 PM
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QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 17 2018, 06:53 AM) *
That noise may just be a brake rotor rubbing a bit (nothing is ever perfectly flat for long on these cars). Lift the back, put it in park or 1st gear and spin the rear wheel by hand. I suspect you'll hear the same noise.

However, and I may be incorrect, I thought these cars had enough clutch disengagement that the rear wheels would stay stationary with the motor running and the clutch pedal depressed. I know it can drag a little due to tight clearances, but I don't remember how much drag I've seen from other cars. If I get the front end of mine back off the ramps (I still have to put the power steering lines and pump on it, if it ever gets warm in the garage) I can lift it and do the same test for you.


I know that my noise is coming from the clutch, easier to tell in person than the video I guess. I'm curious to see how you're does. Mine does seem to engage quick when letting out the pedal. Just to put it out there, I had to use two thick shims on the slave to get the right measurements going by ticks guidance. And it's a stock ls7 clutch with RAM (*edit not spec) billet steel flywheel.

This post has been edited by mikedamageinc: Jan 17 2018, 04:21 PM
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trackbird
post Jan 17 2018, 02:46 PM
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QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Jan 17 2018, 08:52 AM) *
QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 17 2018, 06:53 AM) *
That noise may just be a brake rotor rubbing a bit (nothing is ever perfectly flat for long on these cars). Lift the back, put it in park or 1st gear and spin the rear wheel by hand. I suspect you'll hear the same noise.

However, and I may be incorrect, I thought these cars had enough clutch disengagement that the rear wheels would stay stationary with the motor running and the clutch pedal depressed. I know it can drag a little due to tight clearances, but I don't remember how much drag I've seen from other cars. If I get the front end of mine back off the ramps (I still have to put the power steering lines and pump on it, if it ever gets warm in the garage) I can lift it and do the same test for you.


I know that my noise is coming from the clutch, easier to tell in person than the video I guess. I'm curious to see how you're does. Mine does seem to engage quick when letting out the pedal. Just to put it out there, I had to use two thick shims on the slave to get the right measurements going by ticks guidance. And it's a stock ls7 clutch with spec billet steel flywheel.


Hmm. I threw in a Fidanza with a Centerforce Dual Friction and Ram adjustable master (adjusted to stock) and a Ram slave (looks like a stock slave for too much money to me, but they couldn't point fingers at another vendor if I still had issues so I bought both). No shims. Mine acted a bit like yours until I bled it, but that didn't take much on my car.
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trackbird
post Jan 17 2018, 06:22 PM
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I forgot to mention that I found a spare ABS module out of a wrecked 2002 Z28 convertible with 8700 miles on it. Paid $53 (paypal total) "shipped". I figure I'll keep it on the shelf, that should guarantee that I never need one. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
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CrashTestDummy
post Jan 17 2018, 09:04 PM
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QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 17 2018, 12:22 PM) *
I forgot to mention that I found a spare ABS module out of a wrecked 2002 Z28 convertible with 8700 miles on it. Paid $53 (paypal total) "shipped". I figure I'll keep it on the shelf, that should guarantee that I never need one. (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)


Don't ever throw it out, or...... (IMG:http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)
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79T/A
post Jan 17 2018, 09:32 PM
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LOL I just threw my old ABS pump in the garbage.

I’ll keep you updated on the vette conversion. I’m going to be running a super light 7.25 clutch and Tilton flywheel so I anticipate some really nice shifting. Even when my old T56 was in good shape I thought it was extremely notchy compared to more modern transmissions.
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mikedamageinc
post Jan 26 2018, 10:22 PM
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So I just did the adjustable stock master cylinder and it works so much better. I haven't had a chance to redo the wheels in the air test but I bet it's not dragging anymore.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-transmiss...er-writeup.html
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trackbird
post Jan 27 2018, 03:07 AM
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QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Jan 26 2018, 05:22 PM) *
So I just did the adjustable stock master cylinder and it works so much better. I haven't had a chance to redo the wheels in the air test but I bet it's not dragging anymore.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-transmiss...er-writeup.html


That's good news. And I think it will go a long way towards solving your issues. Keep us posted.

Who does an adjustable stock master? (Besides RAM, that's basically what I got from RAM).
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rocky
post Feb 3 2018, 03:44 PM
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I did the same thing to my stock master. So far so good with mine.
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GCrites80s
post Feb 3 2018, 04:27 PM
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QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 26 2018, 10:07 PM) *
QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Jan 26 2018, 05:22 PM) *
So I just did the adjustable stock master cylinder and it works so much better. I haven't had a chance to redo the wheels in the air test but I bet it's not dragging anymore.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-transmiss...er-writeup.html


That's good news. And I think it will go a long way towards solving your issues. Keep us posted.

Who does an adjustable stock master? (Besides RAM, that's basically what I got from RAM).



Hawk's/Tilton has one now: http://www.hawksmotorsports.com/98-02-cama...r-cylinder-kit/
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79T/A
post Feb 7 2018, 03:47 AM
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Looks like an exact copy of the Tick Performance piece. Guess that’s why everyone was freaking out a few years back.
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trackbird
post Feb 7 2018, 12:00 PM
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QUOTE (GCrites80s @ Feb 3 2018, 11:27 AM) *
QUOTE (trackbird @ Jan 26 2018, 10:07 PM) *
QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Jan 26 2018, 05:22 PM) *
So I just did the adjustable stock master cylinder and it works so much better. I haven't had a chance to redo the wheels in the air test but I bet it's not dragging anymore.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-transmiss...er-writeup.html


That's good news. And I think it will go a long way towards solving your issues. Keep us posted.

Who does an adjustable stock master? (Besides RAM, that's basically what I got from RAM).



Hawk's/Tilton has one now: http://www.hawksmotorsports.com/98-02-cama...r-cylinder-kit/


They say that moves 3 times the fluid. That sounds like 3 times the pedal effort. Typically hydraulics work on a ratio and moving more fluid on the pump end makes the effort higher.
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mikedamageinc
post Feb 7 2018, 01:19 PM
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So I with my adjustable stock master adjusted to what feels right and did the wheels in the air test again. I still hear the disc slide against PP or FW but much less and this may be as good as it gets. It really only rubs maybe 10-15 degrees of rotation. Either way driving around feels much better, no high RPM shifts yet, just hard to do on a traffic commute, need to find a desolate country road or something, or just wait a month until next track event.
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trackbird
post Feb 7 2018, 01:24 PM
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QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Feb 7 2018, 08:19 AM) *
It really only rubs maybe 10-15 degrees of rotation.


That could just be a little run out in the flywheel/crank flange. It wouldn't take much to cause it to rub.

When I installed my adjustable master, I lined it up with the stock one and sent the pushrod to the stock length. Tossed it in and it runs perfectly. So I'm assuming that's all I needed. I'm running the Fidanza/Centerforce Dual Friction combo with a Ram master and slave.
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rocky
post Feb 7 2018, 02:46 PM
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QUOTE (mikedamageinc @ Feb 7 2018, 08:19 AM) *
So I with my adjustable stock master adjusted to what feels right and did the wheels in the air test again. I still hear the disc slide against PP or FW but much less and this may be as good as it gets. It really only rubs maybe 10-15 degrees of rotation. Either way driving around feels much better, no high RPM shifts yet, just hard to do on a traffic commute, need to find a desolate country road or something, or just wait a month until next track event.

I am about an hour north of you. Plenty up here. York county has some decent ones too
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JimMueller
post Feb 7 2018, 04:24 PM
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QUOTE (trackbird @ Feb 7 2018, 07:00 AM) *
They say that moves 3 times the fluid. That sounds like 3 times the pedal effort. Typically hydraulics work on a ratio and moving more fluid on the pump end makes the effort higher.

My understanding is that the larger the MC bore (7/8" in the Hawk version above), the less you need to move the pedal for it to disengage, and thus the smaller the friction engagement window becomes. In turn, it subjectively makes the vehicle less friendly to drive. Tick offers multiple bore sizes, and there are people on Tech which used the normal Tick bore (7/8") and switched to slightly smaller bore (5/8" or 11/16") to get some of the OEM drivability back.
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trackbird
post Feb 7 2018, 05:31 PM
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QUOTE (JimMueller @ Feb 7 2018, 11:24 AM) *
QUOTE (trackbird @ Feb 7 2018, 07:00 AM) *
They say that moves 3 times the fluid. That sounds like 3 times the pedal effort. Typically hydraulics work on a ratio and moving more fluid on the pump end makes the effort higher.

My understanding is that the larger the MC bore (7/8" in the Hawk version above), the less you need to move the pedal for it to disengage, and thus the smaller the friction engagement window becomes. In turn, it subjectively makes the vehicle less friendly to drive. Tick offers multiple bore sizes, and there are people on Tech which used the normal Tick bore (7/8") and switched to slightly smaller bore (5/8" or 11/16") to get some of the OEM drivability back.


I agree with that part as well.

The reason you can lift a car with a hydraulic jack is you are moving a small amount of fluid with the long stroke of the jack handle. All of those "pumps" combined make enough fluid volume to lift the car. If the jack had a 1 to 1 hydraulic ratio between the jack and the ram that lifts the vehicle, your only increased leverage would be from the handle. Increasing the diameter will make the engagement window smaller, it will also increase pedal force due to the piston area of the master and slave being closer in size. You lose mechanical advantage.
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